rental idea...and seattle owners... - Page 4

BruceWright · 06-04-2003, 03:13 PM

Sometimes I think we would have had an easier time if LLC just introduced the Segway as a non-tandem electric bike with better stopping and a slower top speed than an e-bike.

That's what it is, after all.

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

Linc2000 · 06-04-2003, 03:24 PM

I don't think requiring insurance for a Segway is unreasonable. It sends two messages: 1. The Segway owner has taken responsibility for actions on his/her Segway. 2. An insurance company believes the risks of possible damage by Segway operators are minimal. Two good messages to send to politicians who must provide for the safety of the public. Lincoln

I put my Progressive Insurance tag (there is a place to write your policy number on the tag)on the keychain with my Segway key.

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pt · 06-04-2003, 03:26 PM

frank has a great question.

on steve's site it says this (http://www.humantransport.org/univer...ess/page5.html):
Bicyclists are drivers of vehicles; every street is a bicycle facility. ...Traffic law in every state assigns bicycle operators all of the rights and duties of drivers of vehicles on roads.

so my thought is...bikes seem to be treated "different" depending where they are being operated. johnm said "wee bit hypocritical" is that the same here? i don't think so, i think each method of use needs to be looked at, and it does matter where you are.

in my city, a bike is allowed on the street (vehicle) sidewalks (pedestrian) and all parks and trails (pedestrian).

perhaps it's fair to suggest or ask if segways could do the same?

cheers,
pt

======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

BruceWright · 06-04-2003, 03:45 PM

pt..

I think it's a very light grey area.

I do think that taking the electric bicycle point of view would be a good way to find common ground. The Segway is fundmentally the same as an electric bicycle in every way, except the ways a Segway would be even less obtrusive.

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

fredkap · 06-04-2003, 03:53 PM

PT, I know that your thought is to show proof of insurance to raise the bar so to speak, but the rental company might have insurance that covers all of their riders. Also, the City won't want to have to verify each year that a policy was renewed. However a deposit required for each separate rider would be prohibitive for a rental company and having the deposit or the bulk of the deposit refundable in a year would be too unreasonable for a casual renter but no big deal for an owner. ($100 Safe Segging Deposit refundable in 1 year if you have practiced safe segging.)

JohnM · 06-04-2003, 03:58 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by pt
i think each method of use needs to be looked at, and it does matter where you are.

Good point.
This is why one of the more thorough EPAMD laws so far is the one in Wisconsin. Maybe too thorough. It's extremely difficult to follow because they went through the entire traffic code and added 'and EPAMDs' almost everywhere the word pedestrian or bicycle occured. They recognize the that on the sidewalks and crosswalks, EPAMDs are to be treated as pedestrians, while on the streets they are given the same status as bikes. They don't call an EPAMD a vehicle or pedestrian, just an electric personal assistive mobility device that has different rights a responsibilities depending on where it is used.

You Segway owners have a unique conveyance that can be equally at home
on the street, sidewalk and indoors. Attaching a single definition of 'vehicle' or 'pedestrian' on yourself doesn't do you justice.

pt · 06-04-2003, 04:33 PM

johnm-

this has been a great dicussion. thanks for helping us define and refine some thinking.

hopefully we can score a meeting with the park and dot folks asap and see what they're doing.

cheers,
pt

======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

scepter77 · 06-04-2003, 05:52 PM

Sorry to ask a question that all of you have probably discussed a hundred times, but what are the drawbacks of trying to get the state to issue licenses, not for the segway but for the individual. (or maybe for both) Even if it meant experienced owners volunteering at the dmv occasionally to certify people. I assume it would just mean added revenue for the state and would certify that the owner has some skill on the device. You could even require insurance verification for annual renewal of your segway registration.

What are the roadblocks you may have discussed?

06-04-2003, 03:13 PM	#31
BruceWright Advanced Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sherman Oaks (Los Angeles), California, USA. Posts: 3,296	Sometimes I think we would have had an easier time if LLC just introduced the Segway as a non-tandem electric bike with better stopping and a slower top speed than an e-bike. That's what it is, after all. -Bruce Wright Segway: Vehicle of Dream

06-04-2003, 03:24 PM	#32
Linc2000 Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: San Diego, California, USA. Posts: 396	I don't think requiring insurance for a Segway is unreasonable. It sends two messages: 1. The Segway owner has taken responsibility for actions on his/her Segway. 2. An insurance company believes the risks of possible damage by Segway operators are minimal. Two good messages to send to politicians who must provide for the safety of the public. Lincoln I put my Progressive Insurance tag (there is a place to write your policy number on the tag)on the keychain with my Segway key. <center> </center>

06-04-2003, 03:26 PM	#33
pt Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: seattle, wa, USA. Posts: 3,000	frank has a great question. on steve's site it says this (http://www.humantransport.org/univer...ess/page5.html): Bicyclists are drivers of vehicles; every street is a bicycle facility. ...Traffic law in every state assigns bicycle operators all of the rights and duties of drivers of vehicles on roads. so my thought is...bikes seem to be treated "different" depending where they are being operated. johnm said "wee bit hypocritical" is that the same here? i don't think so, i think each method of use needs to be looked at, and it does matter where you are. in my city, a bike is allowed on the street (vehicle) sidewalks (pedestrian) and all parks and trails (pedestrian). perhaps it's fair to suggest or ask if segways could do the same? cheers, pt ====================== segway ht journal: http://www.bookofseg.com other stuff: http://www.flashenabled.com

06-04-2003, 03:45 PM	#34
BruceWright Advanced Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sherman Oaks (Los Angeles), California, USA. Posts: 3,296	pt.. I think it's a very light grey area. I do think that taking the electric bicycle point of view would be a good way to find common ground. The Segway is fundmentally the same as an electric bicycle in every way, except the ways a Segway would be even less obtrusive. -Bruce Wright Segway: Vehicle of Dream

06-04-2003, 03:53 PM	#35
fredkap Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Los Angeles - Westside, CA, USA. Posts: 1,336	PT, I know that your thought is to show proof of insurance to raise the bar so to speak, but the rental company might have insurance that covers all of their riders. Also, the City won't want to have to verify each year that a policy was renewed. However a deposit required for each separate rider would be prohibitive for a rental company and having the deposit or the bulk of the deposit refundable in a year would be too unreasonable for a casual renter but no big deal for an owner. ($100 Safe Segging Deposit refundable in 1 year if you have practiced safe segging.)

06-04-2003, 04:33 PM	#37
pt Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: seattle, wa, USA. Posts: 3,000	johnm- this has been a great dicussion. thanks for helping us define and refine some thinking. hopefully we can score a meeting with the park and dot folks asap and see what they're doing. cheers, pt ====================== segway ht journal: http://www.bookofseg.com other stuff: http://www.flashenabled.com

06-04-2003, 05:52 PM	#38
scepter77 Junior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Salem, OR, . Posts: 41	Sorry to ask a question that all of you have probably discussed a hundred times, but what are the drawbacks of trying to get the state to issue licenses, not for the segway but for the individual. (or maybe for both) Even if it meant experienced owners volunteering at the dmv occasionally to certify people. I assume it would just mean added revenue for the state and would certify that the owner has some skill on the device. You could even require insurance verification for annual renewal of your segway registration. What are the roadblocks you may have discussed?

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