We <dislike> Irresponsible Renters

[tsg]

Wow. Where to begin?

I think the idea and purpose behind these forums is great, and I'm glad we have them. That said, what actually exists in practice seems to fall far short of ideal.

Regardless of how you feel about rentals, the authoritarian stance of "I'm right and you can't possibly be right... and certainly nowhere near as right as I am." doesn't do anyone good. The same goes for "You're not doing as much (or as experienced) as I am, and you should be like me" stuff. The 'last-word'isms and repetitive quoted posts do show the true colors of the posters, however. There is room enough for every opinion, and little value to reponding to everyone's posts just to reiterate your own.

If rental situations are to be improved, then that is where productive comments/suggestions/ideas/opinions should aim their focus - IMHO. I would like to think Segway LLC could read these forums and perhaps utilize our better ideas as a resource. I believe that will not be the case, as there is so much conflict here.

Rentals, like anything new, will be less than perfect. I tend to think in time however, even HT owners will benefit from rentals. It's a heck of an endeavor to pack and carry or ship an HT if you're traveling - I think it would be great to know that I could rent one when I go visit friends and family in other parts of the country.

Segway LLC needs to do more on behalf of their 'constituency'. I guess it's easier said than done. So many issues, so many locations.

PR/lobbying/regulation is their responsibility (an owner's obligation ends at safe and responsible use). IMHO lobbying and fighting for regulations can be too much of a burden to place on owners/customers for something in such a minority. The HT isn't a bicycle, scooter, motorcycle, car, etc -- it is something completely new.

I don't blame them for trying the "Be our ambassador!" approach, but it doesn't scale well and there is no way to ensure consistency of message. Clearly that goes for training as well. These issues will only grow in scope as more HTs hit the streets, rental or otherwise.

I hope all of our better natures will eventually shine through in these forums, and thanks Kelsey and others for continuing to stay rational amongst the fray.

-T

[pt]

tsg-

you don't seem to realize that some rental places can and will force bans, so "in time" there isn't anything helpful for owners.

right now, all we can do, is try our best (if we care) to work with these rental places and our cities.

if you have any ideas besides saying segway, llc should do it all, please help.

cheers,
pt



======================

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[pam]

quote:PR/lobbying/regulation is their responsibility (an owner's obligation ends at safe and responsible use). IMHO lobbying and fighting for regulations can be too much of a burden to place on owners/customers for something in such a minority. The HT isn't a bicycle, scooter, motorcycle, car, etc -- it is something completely new.

I don't blame them for trying the "Be our ambassador!" approach, but it doesn't scale well and there is no way to ensure consistency of message. Clearly that goes for training as well. These issues will only grow in scope as more HTs hit the streets, rental or otherwise.

This is all just my opinion... I think we all tend to forget that Segway is a SMALL company. We think that because the product they produce is a high-end product that they must be huge. They don't have the resources in personnel to do everything some would like to think of as "their responsibility." - I do believe they're trying.

That said, I don't know that they feel it is "our responsibility" to get involved in the political struggle. They're shown that they're willing to do that - as soon as they know that a political struggle is in the offering. I do think that they originally thought that if they could get the legislation passed at the State level, we would be covered as riders. I'm not sure they thought they'd have to fight the battle in every small town in America.

But they are aware that it only takes a few irresponsible Segway owners to make their work almost impossible. I think our "ambassadorship" is more in the area of using our Segways responsible - and getting involved locally, if that is our natural inclination. After all, the people most likely to listen to us are those that are concerned that our votes might affect them. It's very easy to discount emails and letters from miles and miles away as "they don't know our area, they don't have any local clout, they don't have any local affect to either my job or my economy."

That said, I do think that those of us who are disabled have a voice that transcends community lines and distance.
Pam

[AtlSeg]

Kelsey and TSG, thanks for your posts. They were breaths of reason and fresh air.

Dick (Richard) in Atlanta

[tsg]

pt

I will do my best to emulate some of your posts in an effort to reach you.

quote:tsg-

you don't seem to realize that some rental places can and will force bans, so "in time" there isn't anything helpful for owners.

I will counter that you have NO idea what I realize, and claiming such is simply arrogant and ignorant. As you have outlined the risks rentals pose in your posts on this subject, to the point of being redundant, how you can come to that conclusion is beyond my grasp. Since rental people with lose their business if bans come into play, it probably interests them to improve training and other associated processes. As I said in my original post, I think rentals can be a great way to avoid packing and transporting an HT when traveling. That would indeed be helpful for owners.

quote:
right now, all we can do, is try our best (if we care) to work with these rental places and our cities.

No problems with that, except for the "(if we care)" bit. It is obvious that there is an great deal of care shown by all the users of this forum. Passions run deep for the HT and its use.
I will point out the difficulties we face working together in these forums - if it's an indication, it doesn't bode well for working with others of any affiliation.

quote:
if you have any ideas besides saying segway, llc should do it all, please help.

cheers,
pt

In my post, I declared it to be Segway LLC's responsibility (be that to organize or actively work with us) to deal with PR/lobbying etc. I never stated anything close to what you've implied. You are paraphrasing my post inaccurately, and claiming I said they should DO it all.

PR/lobbying/regulation is/was/always will be their responsibility as it is their business, their profits, their product. We can and will certainly help, as we all have a vested interest in what occurs, but they should be setting the tone, organizing us, and defining the messaging to put forth. Regardless of their size as a company, that doesn't change. We are a resource they can leverage, but only if they choose to do so.

"If you have any ideas besides..." All I can take from that is you do not care for my current ideas (even though it appears you don't know what they are), and don't care for my posting them.

I suggest more care be given in verbiage you choose, if it is not your intention to attack/offend/cause unnecessary conflict. We will all progress much farther in our efforts if we can avoid the extraneous arguments and remember that we are all on the same side.

*cheers*

--T

[BruceWright]

quote:Originally posted by tsg



I don't blame them for trying the "Be our ambassador!" approach, but it doesn't scale well and there is no way to ensure consistency of message. Clearly that goes for training as well. These issues will only grow in scope as more HTs hit the streets, rental or otherwise.

Wow, very important point. I think you are right on with this one. "Be our ambassadors" has got all of us arguing in this topic and the 10 related topics about how to be the best ambassadors.

It reminds me of the warring religious factions in Monty Python's life of Brian. "Follow the sandal!!!!" "No, Infidels! Follow the Gourd!!"

"Ban the Rentals" "No, Infidel! Embrace the rentals!"

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream