Eric Payne

[jryan]

Originally Posted by wwhopper

I was unaware that he had been removed.

I would think that would have been due to his own personal request. But you would have to ask him about that. I know he had a couple of real good tussles with Pam, and probably with John too.

Members do not get removed, they just get put on moderation, or even banned, but never removed. I have not found him in the data base, so I will have to find out what happened to his user profile.

It was acknowledged to me that he was completely removed by none other than Pam. She said it was by his request and I never really asked him whether or not this was true. Therefore I will not say he did or didn't request it! Regardless, his account was removed completely! Even a certain banned member has a profile!!


Jeremy Ryan

[jryan]

It also says he is a 5+ year member which is not true, I think we all know that!!



Jeremy Ryan

[RAG1247]

Originally Posted by jryan

It was acknowledged to me that he was completely removed by none other than Pam. She said it was by his request and I never really asked him whether or not this was true. Therefore I will not say he did or didn't request it! Regardless, his account was removed completely! Even a certain banned member has a profile!!


Jeremy Ryan

seems hard to imagine why you wouldn't ask him if he requested to be removed ????????????????????

[JohnG]

Let me be very clear here -- Eric Payne asked to be removed. When a member asks us to be removed, we sit on the request for a few days in case they change their mind. If they haven't changed their minds, their account is removed as they requested.

There's nothing more than that that went on with Eric Payne. As for why he wanted his account removed, that's his business, so you'd have to ask him...

John

[wwhopper]

For checking in on this, and answering the question, and eliminating all the speculation about Eric.

Members are removed for two reasons that I know of, SPAMMERS (none of us want them) and members who request to have their membership and profile removed from the system, some also request to have all of their posts removed.

Members who are banned, still are in the system, just the system sees they are listed as banned so they can not access the forums.

Members who are moderated can access the main form, not live chat or send Private Messages, due to recent mis-uses of the system. When they post it goes into a area where the moderators can see it, and then approve it if it is acceptable. If not they can then send a message to poster explaining the problem.

Anyone who comes onto Segway Chat for the first time, who we do not know, has to prove to us they will be responsible members of the chat.

[KSagal]

Originally Posted by wwhopper

For checking in on this, and answering the question, and eliminating all the speculation about Eric.

Members are removed for two reasons that I know of, SPAMMERS (none of us want them) and members who request to have their membership and profile removed from the system, some also request to have all of their posts removed.

Members who are banned, still are in the system, just the system sees they are listed as banned so they can not access the forums.

Members who are moderated can access the main form, not live chat or send Private Messages, due to recent mis-uses of the system. When they post it goes into a area where the moderators can see it, and then approve it if it is acceptable. If not they can then send a message to poster explaining the problem.

Anyone who comes onto Segway Chat for the first time, who we do not know, has to prove to us they will be responsible members of the chat.

We all know that there are two sides to any story. What may seem reasonable to one side, may seem unreasonable to the other side.

This forum is managed with an unyielding hand. They take some actions in response to things that happen here and other places, and some posters may object, but feel they have no capacity to speak to those actions on an even footing. They feel that way because it is true.

That is the cost of posting here. It is the way of the moderators, or the highway. The moderators run the show here, and this is not a democracy.

That cost is too high for some to bear. They move on.

Others simply move on for other reasons. That is the way the online world, and the outside world works.

For anyone to say that Eric did not feel the overwhelming pressure to conform (to whatever the moderators told him to do) or leave, is being disingenuous. That is the same cost we all have to pay, but it is harder for some to bear than others...

[jryan]

Originally Posted by RAG1247

seems hard to imagine why you wouldn't ask him if he requested to be removed ????????????????????

It may seem hard for you to imagine not hard for me!! What difference does it make Richard?? I consider both Pam and Eric friends. There is no need for me to get involved in their quarrels unless I see something out of line! Whether or not she removed him by his request or not is none of my business!





Jeremy Ryan

[JohnG]

I agree, Karl, there are two sides to every story, and without Eric here to defend his side, I can't imagine this is going to be a fair discussion to him.

Since Eric left of his own accord, he's welcomed back any time.

John

[jryan]

The fact is that there are two sides to every story and those two sides are hardly ever the same! If Eric or Pam came here and said their side I am sure tehy would be different! The fact is that it is best to stay out, for the most part of other people's quarrels! The reason for this is that you, as a bystander, will NEVER know the true story. You can get ideas, but it is important not to make judgements! I am doubtful either one of them will come here and say their side however!

This iis the same for every struggle between two people whether here or not. That is why, in public, I remain impartial. I have ideas, but unless it involves me I do not make judgements! I think it is important for us all to do the same! You can have opinions, but opinions and judgements are different!



Jeremy Ryan

[KSagal]

Originally Posted by jryan

The fact is that there are two sides to every story and those two sides are hardly ever the same! If Eric or Pam came here and said their side I am sure tehy would be different! The fact is that it is best to stay out, for the most part of other people's quarrels! The reason for this is that you, as a bystander, will NEVER know the true story. You can get ideas, but it is important not to make judgements! I am doubtful either one of them will come here and say their side however!

This iis the same for every struggle between two people whether here or not. That is why, in public, I remain impartial. I have ideas, but unless it involves me I do not make judgements! I think it is important for us all to do the same! You can have opinions, but opinions and judgements are different!

Jeremy Ryan

Jeremy,

There is an old story, that related to why the German People, who were generally an honorable people, allowed the Nazi's to lead their country into such a horrible path...

Greatly shortened, it went like this:

When the Green Police (Nazi's) came for the Gipsies, we said nothing. When they came for the disidents, and the Poles, we said nothing. When they came for the Jews, we said nothing. When they came for the people with dark hair, we said nothing...

When they came for me, there was no one left to complain...


The idea of speaking out against injustice has it's own merit. It does not matter who the players are. If you feel it is a wrong, then it needs to be addressed.

Now, it does not matter if you agree with Pam or Eric. The point is, if you feel that something wrong has occured, even if it is too late for Eric, we can improve the system for the next guy. It could be you.

If you feel that nothing wrong occured, you need to support the system, against attack, so that it can happen correctly the next time.

Sitting back and saying you will not get involved is fine, if that is what you feel comfortable with, but not everyone will feel that way.

By the way, of all the people I would peg as impartial in public, you would not be at the top of my list. Your passion and clear support of the things you feel important is an important piece of your persona, and the thing that has endeared you to this community. Drifting toward the center is not a bad thing, but not necessarily a good thing either...

Lastly, a public squabble like this is rarely what it seems to be to the rest of us... Pam acted as she did, but I am sure there are things that Eric knew that never got expressed. Eric acted as he did, but I am sure that Pam knew things that never got expressed. Both of them knew things that we do not... That also is the way the world works, you hear things, and have to fill in the blanks as best you can.

Regardless of how you view this, one thing that I believe is accross the board, is that Eric brought some real value to this community and this forum, and his departure is a loss to all of us.

And of course, leaving and having your impact expunged are two very different things. Try as some might, history cannot be re-written. The only thing you can do is mis-inform the next group that comes along...