Military Academy - Use Denied

russ498 · 02-25-2010, 09:59 AM

I recently asked permission to use a Segway as a mobility device at the US Naval Academy. The request was rejected for two reasons as quoted below:

1) "We fully support the use of mobility devices for the disabled; however the ability of the Segway to travel at relatively high speeds makes it significantly different from normal mobility devises such as motorized chairs."

2) "Often we have large crowds moving from one place to another in the capacity of their duties as well as large crowds from sporting and other special events. Due to these crowded conditions, the limited areas of the Naval Academy, and other safety considerations such as uneven historic walks, Segway operation on the on the facility is not approved."

They add. "The use of a standard mobility device is fully supported." and "We allow personnel with handicap credentials to drive their vehicles aboard the facility and part in marked handicapped parking spots."

I don't know where to begin. In my request I offered to travel at a walking pace. I did not inform them that the Segway can be programed to a specific speed.

The argument about the uneven pavement is ludicrous. If it is unsafe for a Segway, it's unsafe for a pedestrian or any other mobility device.

They refer to standard Mobility devises. Has any legal entity actually defined a standard mobility device?

As a side note, their comment concerning the handicapped parking spots is laughable. Handicapped parking on the facility is virtually nonexistent in the areas of the facility that I need to visit.

At this point, I am going to respond to their letter of denial with my arguments. I would like to get your input so that I can make the most compelling argument possible.

I have seen a good bit of information dated from 2008 where the ADA defines “Other power driven mobility device." what I saw basically was a request for input prior to initiating new regulations. Does anyone know if the regulation ever went into effect? Does anyone know if there are any other relevant laws, case law or regulations that I should cite?

It is my strong preference to resolve this diplomatically; however, If I'm denied again, it is my intention to take this to court. Is there anyone that I should contact that may be of assistance, should this be necessary?

ps. Sorry for the repetition, but I posting this on multiple sites so I get as much input as possible.

Thanks

Russ Hewitt

[email protected]

KSagal · 02-25-2010, 12:47 PM

Russ,

My first stop would be DRAFT.org.

If you want to take them on point by point, you may want to consider some of the findings from government or quasi government studies that rank segways well, even in comparison to power chairs...

Since there is no such thing as a 'standard' mobility device, you could go two ways on that one... You could simply declare that a segway is a 'standard' mobility device (as defined by ADA) and ask them to prove otherwise...

Or you could ask them to provide you with a government approved list of standard devices that complies with the ADA, which they will not be able to do, because it does not exist...

I would go with the first option, as it leaves it to them to prove you wrong, instead of leaving it to them to make up a list that does not include segways...

This brings up some good questions...

1. Does the Government buildings ruling that permits segways apply? I do not have the details here at work, but I believe there is a federal government policy that permits segways in government facilities...

2. Just how fast do other mobility devices go? I wonder how hard it would be to find a series of electric wheelchairs, mobility scooters, and other devices that more closely fit the ignorant public's view of what a mobility device is supposed to look like, and rate their speed? I have seen a couple people in wheel chairs moving pretty well along the side of the road, I would guess faster than turtle mode... (I have never raced anyone)

Good luck. I hope more informed people offer up more cogent points of consideration for you….

russ498 · 02-25-2010, 12:58 PM

check your e-mail. I would like some additional information. Thanks

Lily Kerns · 02-25-2010, 03:06 PM

http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...deral_hallways

The education page of the draft.org site has a number of useful links.

02-25-2010, 09:59 AM	#1
russ498 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Pasadena & Ocean City, MD, USA Posts: 83	Military Academy - Use Denied I recently asked permission to use a Segway as a mobility device at the US Naval Academy. The request was rejected for two reasons as quoted below: 1) "We fully support the use of mobility devices for the disabled; however the ability of the Segway to travel at relatively high speeds makes it significantly different from normal mobility devises such as motorized chairs." 2) "Often we have large crowds moving from one place to another in the capacity of their duties as well as large crowds from sporting and other special events. Due to these crowded conditions, the limited areas of the Naval Academy, and other safety considerations such as uneven historic walks, Segway operation on the on the facility is not approved." They add. "The use of a standard mobility device is fully supported." and "We allow personnel with handicap credentials to drive their vehicles aboard the facility and part in marked handicapped parking spots." I don't know where to begin. In my request I offered to travel at a walking pace. I did not inform them that the Segway can be programed to a specific speed. The argument about the uneven pavement is ludicrous. If it is unsafe for a Segway, it's unsafe for a pedestrian or any other mobility device. They refer to standard Mobility devises. Has any legal entity actually defined a standard mobility device? As a side note, their comment concerning the handicapped parking spots is laughable. Handicapped parking on the facility is virtually nonexistent in the areas of the facility that I need to visit. At this point, I am going to respond to their letter of denial with my arguments. I would like to get your input so that I can make the most compelling argument possible. I have seen a good bit of information dated from 2008 where the ADA defines “Other power driven mobility device." what I saw basically was a request for input prior to initiating new regulations. Does anyone know if the regulation ever went into effect? Does anyone know if there are any other relevant laws, case law or regulations that I should cite? It is my strong preference to resolve this diplomatically; however, If I'm denied again, it is my intention to take this to court. Is there anyone that I should contact that may be of assistance, should this be necessary? ps. Sorry for the repetition, but I posting this on multiple sites so I get as much input as possible. Thanks Russ Hewitt [email protected]

02-25-2010, 12:47 PM	#2
KSagal Glides a lot, talks more... Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Pelham, NH, USA. Posts: 10,356	Russ, My first stop would be DRAFT.org. If you want to take them on point by point, you may want to consider some of the findings from government or quasi government studies that rank segways well, even in comparison to power chairs... Since there is no such thing as a 'standard' mobility device, you could go two ways on that one... You could simply declare that a segway is a 'standard' mobility device (as defined by ADA) and ask them to prove otherwise... Or you could ask them to provide you with a government approved list of standard devices that complies with the ADA, which they will not be able to do, because it does not exist... I would go with the first option, as it leaves it to them to prove you wrong, instead of leaving it to them to make up a list that does not include segways... This brings up some good questions... 1. Does the Government buildings ruling that permits segways apply? I do not have the details here at work, but I believe there is a federal government policy that permits segways in government facilities... 2. Just how fast do other mobility devices go? I wonder how hard it would be to find a series of electric wheelchairs, mobility scooters, and other devices that more closely fit the ignorant public's view of what a mobility device is supposed to look like, and rate their speed? I have seen a couple people in wheel chairs moving pretty well along the side of the road, I would guess faster than turtle mode... (I have never raced anyone) Good luck. I hope more informed people offer up more cogent points of consideration for you…. __________________ Karl Ian Sagal To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. "Well done is better than well said." (Ben Franklin) Bene factum melior bene dictum Proud past President of SEG America and member of the First Premier Segway Enthusiasts Group and subsequent ones as well.

02-25-2010, 03:06 PM	#4
Lily Kerns Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: SW Missouri, near Springfield Posts: 875	Link for Information http://www.computerworld.com/s/artic...deral_hallways The education page of the draft.org site has a number of useful links. __________________ Lily Kerns ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Faculty: To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

02-25-2010, 12:58 PM	#3
russ498 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Pasadena & Ocean City, MD, USA Posts: 83	check your e-mail. I would like some additional information. Thanks

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