We <dislike> Irresponsible Renters - Page 2

ftropea · 06-01-2003, 12:46 PM

MrLeisure,

Your post makes me wonder if more people just aren't seeing the "big picture" here. Yes, safety is important. Nobody wants to see anyone get hurt. But you know what the bigger issue is? Whether or not our rights to Seg will be impacted by the business practices of some of these "hit and run" rental companies.

Take a few minutes and catch up on the latest happenings. Look at the situation in Seattle. Also, check out what this rental Co. in Canada is doing. If this keeps up, there will be fewer and fewer places you can ride your Seg. To put it in your terms - this will be the equivalent of not having a place to have sex with your hooker.

Regards,

Frank A. Tropea

Admin - "Keep your wheels on the ground!" - Contact Me

nocanfly · 06-01-2003, 12:55 PM

Perhaps Segway LLC should take a proactive role in working with rental companies by establishing guidelines and recommendations on how a rental company should operate. They should a put a package together they could provide to anyone who wants to start a rental business. There are going to be a lot of new rental companies opening in the future and there's nothing you can do to stop that. So I believe it's in everyone's best interest if Segway LLC provided entrepreneurs the support to start such a business.

You can't stop capitalism and the freedom in starting a company. it's up to Segway LLC to try to 'regulate' the industry. Most new industries in the beginning tend to be unregulated but eventually they get regulated through the competitive nature of capitalism.

ftropea · 06-01-2003, 01:08 PM

NoCan,

I see a contradiction there. Even if Segway LLC put together a package, a "hit and run" rental Co. wouldn't need to adhere to any of those guidelines - and we would still have the problems we've seen in Seattle and Canada. They can't "regulate" greed.

That said, I think this business can be done right. But what is the compelling reason for a Rental Co. to do it right? I say if they want to make money next year, and the year after that - then they'll do it right. If they're just concerned with making some quick cash and are prepared to liquidate in 3 months - then they'll do it the wrong way.

Either way, I don't see anyone making an argument that we should stop rental companies. I see people discussing what some rental companies are doing, how that's worked out and what impact it's had on Seg owners in general.

I think a lot people keep missing the "big picture" here. I see lots of people rushing to the defense and in support of "hit and run" rental companies.. and capitalism. (yay capitalism)

But at the end of the day, when the money is made and the bans are in effect - who is left with $5K Segway HTs sitting in the corner? Exactly.

Regards,

Frank A. Tropea

Admin - "Keep your wheels on the ground!" - Contact Me

nocanfly · 06-01-2003, 01:15 PM

I agree Frank that it's almost impossible to stop greed from renting segways without regard to safety. But Segway could provide incentives. You know "Authorized Segway Rental" status could be provided which means those without this designation would be suddenly appear to be "rogue" if you know what I mean. They could provide discounts for legitimate rental companies who want to purchase Segways. I'm sure there are other ways Segway LLC could be proactive in regulating the Segway rental industry. As you said you can't stop greed but you can reward people who want to do it right.

Plus establishing a Segway Users Association could be a way for you to unite your voices as well to counter greedy unscrupulous individuals who want to make a quick buck.

wayne · 06-01-2003, 01:29 PM

I agree that rental companies are here to stay.
LLC should take part in this before it is to late to help cut down on the ones that are there just to make a fast buck and move on.
Rental companies should be licensed and trained by LLC.
Rental companies that are not licensed by LLC should have their warranties pulled from their Segs. LLC should also put on their web site the rental companies that have been approved by them(LLC).

Seg-On

nocanfly · 06-01-2003, 01:32 PM

Now that's what I'm talking about wayne! I agree about pulling warranties if they are used in an unauthorized manner. It would make someone think before spending all that money.

mrleisure · 06-01-2003, 01:55 PM

NoCanFly, exactly!

You have made the point I was driving at much more easily. Capitalism is ugly, but there is nothing like the free market to quickly sort through things. The "quick buck bad guys" appear in every market. And then the market responds, weeding out those who don't provide good value.

The guys who are setting up Segway rentals now are admirable in their audacity. Thankfully, they are driven by profit and they will be the first to work out what is acceptable training in the real world. If their customers get hurt, they will be forced to either solve the problem or go out of business. If their local town doesn't like them, they will be forced to prove their value or go out of business. They have put their money where their mouths are. They are doing the heavy lifting of deciding what the business model will be.

I think there is too much obsessing about "what will the public think" in these and other forums from current Segway owners. Get out and ride anywhere and people go bananas with excitment at the sight of you, it's undeniable.

Everything new takes a bunch of arrows at first. Think of the Internet Cafe's of the mid 90's. They first got blasted for trying making a buck "because the Internet should be free", then they got blasted because "What if my kid goes in there and downloads porn?" and then they got completely ignored once the Internet became accepted. How quickly we forget that millions of people got their first introduction to the Internet, and then once they saw how awesome it was, bought a computer and got connected because of those first Internet Cafe's.

BruceWright · 06-01-2003, 02:03 PM

Localities should pass safety ordinances on rental agencies, mandating training levels, setting speed limits, limiting number of Segways in an area, etc. Make them adhere to these or lose their business license.

It's done all the time in other areas of business.

(also, perhaps with all these threads, we could neaten up the conversation, folks. Can we have one thread that talks about possible political actions to stop the problem without the other threads leaking in? Folks in this thread are talking about the problem and solutions, and other folks keep chiming in saying there's not a problem. That's a point, but can it live in the other 15 threads that already discuss if there's a problem or not? Otherwise that's the only discussion we ever will get, this constant, constant back and forth: This is a problem, no it's not, yes it is, you shut up, you shut up.)

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

pt · 06-01-2003, 03:43 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by BruceWright Localities should pass safety ordinances on rental agencies, mandating training levels, setting speed limits, limiting number of Segways in an area, etc. Make them adhere to these or lose their business license.

so my city which is already bogged down like most cities needs to enact new systems to regulate the segway rental biz? and then enforce them?

most cities will say, hmm...what's easier?

ban.

in fact, in seattle, that's what they did bruce. the parks dept could spend all this time to study the problem(s) with rentals, but they didn't... they banned. right or wrong that is what happened, and it'll happen again and again.

more gov isn't the answer, we'll need 500 segway gov affairs people to fight thousands of battles.

...and i do not know the answer.

i'm dissapointed that folks aren't looking at the facts again and again.

enjoy for segways folks.

cheers,
pt

======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

willysnout · 06-01-2003, 03:51 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by BruceWright

Localities should pass safety ordinances on rental agencies, mandating training levels, setting speed limits, limiting number of Segways in an area, etc. Make them adhere to these or lose their business license.[/b]

And where will the funds come from to enforce these rules? For instance, what about police with radar detectors to enforce speed limits? Will the maker of Segways perhaps volunteer to pay the extra money? It's a lot cheaper to head these problems off at the pass by banning them for general public use.

Be sure to smell the roses before you lose your sense of smell

06-01-2003, 12:46 PM	#11
ftropea Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA. Posts: 1,778	MrLeisure, Your post makes me wonder if more people just aren't seeing the "big picture" here. Yes, safety is important. Nobody wants to see anyone get hurt. But you know what the bigger issue is? Whether or not our rights to Seg will be impacted by the business practices of some of these "hit and run" rental companies. Take a few minutes and catch up on the latest happenings. Look at the situation in Seattle. Also, check out what this rental Co. in Canada is doing. If this keeps up, there will be fewer and fewer places you can ride your Seg. To put it in your terms - this will be the equivalent of not having a place to have sex with your hooker. Regards, Frank A. Tropea Admin - "Keep your wheels on the ground!" - Contact Me

06-01-2003, 12:55 PM	#12
nocanfly Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: , , . Posts: 76	Perhaps Segway LLC should take a proactive role in working with rental companies by establishing guidelines and recommendations on how a rental company should operate. They should a put a package together they could provide to anyone who wants to start a rental business. There are going to be a lot of new rental companies opening in the future and there's nothing you can do to stop that. So I believe it's in everyone's best interest if Segway LLC provided entrepreneurs the support to start such a business. You can't stop capitalism and the freedom in starting a company. it's up to Segway LLC to try to 'regulate' the industry. Most new industries in the beginning tend to be unregulated but eventually they get regulated through the competitive nature of capitalism.

06-01-2003, 01:08 PM	#13
ftropea Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA. Posts: 1,778	NoCan, I see a contradiction there. Even if Segway LLC put together a package, a "hit and run" rental Co. wouldn't need to adhere to any of those guidelines - and we would still have the problems we've seen in Seattle and Canada. They can't "regulate" greed. That said, I think this business can be done right. But what is the compelling reason for a Rental Co. to do it right? I say if they want to make money next year, and the year after that - then they'll do it right. If they're just concerned with making some quick cash and are prepared to liquidate in 3 months - then they'll do it the wrong way. Either way, I don't see anyone making an argument that we should stop rental companies. I see people discussing what some rental companies are doing, how that's worked out and what impact it's had on Seg owners in general. I think a lot people keep missing the "big picture" here. I see lots of people rushing to the defense and in support of "hit and run" rental companies.. and capitalism. (yay capitalism) But at the end of the day, when the money is made and the bans are in effect - who is left with $5K Segway HTs sitting in the corner? Exactly. Regards, Frank A. Tropea Admin - "Keep your wheels on the ground!" - Contact Me

06-01-2003, 01:15 PM	#14
nocanfly Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: , , . Posts: 76	I agree Frank that it's almost impossible to stop greed from renting segways without regard to safety. But Segway could provide incentives. You know "Authorized Segway Rental" status could be provided which means those without this designation would be suddenly appear to be "rogue" if you know what I mean. They could provide discounts for legitimate rental companies who want to purchase Segways. I'm sure there are other ways Segway LLC could be proactive in regulating the Segway rental industry. As you said you can't stop greed but you can reward people who want to do it right. Plus establishing a Segway Users Association could be a way for you to unite your voices as well to counter greedy unscrupulous individuals who want to make a quick buck.

06-01-2003, 01:29 PM	#15
wayne Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Minden, Louisiana, . Posts: 1,168	I agree that rental companies are here to stay. LLC should take part in this before it is to late to help cut down on the ones that are there just to make a fast buck and move on. Rental companies should be licensed and trained by LLC. Rental companies that are not licensed by LLC should have their warranties pulled from their Segs. LLC should also put on their web site the rental companies that have been approved by them(LLC). Seg-On

06-01-2003, 01:32 PM	#16
nocanfly Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: , , . Posts: 76	Now that's what I'm talking about wayne! I agree about pulling warranties if they are used in an unauthorized manner. It would make someone think before spending all that money.

06-01-2003, 01:55 PM	#17
mrleisure Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Ashland, Or, USA. Posts: 332	NoCanFly, exactly! You have made the point I was driving at much more easily. Capitalism is ugly, but there is nothing like the free market to quickly sort through things. The "quick buck bad guys" appear in every market. And then the market responds, weeding out those who don't provide good value. The guys who are setting up Segway rentals now are admirable in their audacity. Thankfully, they are driven by profit and they will be the first to work out what is acceptable training in the real world. If their customers get hurt, they will be forced to either solve the problem or go out of business. If their local town doesn't like them, they will be forced to prove their value or go out of business. They have put their money where their mouths are. They are doing the heavy lifting of deciding what the business model will be. I think there is too much obsessing about "what will the public think" in these and other forums from current Segway owners. Get out and ride anywhere and people go bananas with excitment at the sight of you, it's undeniable. Everything new takes a bunch of arrows at first. Think of the Internet Cafe's of the mid 90's. They first got blasted for trying making a buck "because the Internet should be free", then they got blasted because "What if my kid goes in there and downloads porn?" and then they got completely ignored once the Internet became accepted. How quickly we forget that millions of people got their first introduction to the Internet, and then once they saw how awesome it was, bought a computer and got connected because of those first Internet Cafe's.

06-01-2003, 02:03 PM	#18
BruceWright Advanced Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sherman Oaks (Los Angeles), California, USA. Posts: 3,296	Localities should pass safety ordinances on rental agencies, mandating training levels, setting speed limits, limiting number of Segways in an area, etc. Make them adhere to these or lose their business license. It's done all the time in other areas of business. (also, perhaps with all these threads, we could neaten up the conversation, folks. Can we have one thread that talks about possible political actions to stop the problem without the other threads leaking in? Folks in this thread are talking about the problem and solutions, and other folks keep chiming in saying there's not a problem. That's a point, but can it live in the other 15 threads that already discuss if there's a problem or not? Otherwise that's the only discussion we ever will get, this constant, constant back and forth: This is a problem, no it's not, yes it is, you shut up, you shut up.) -Bruce Wright Segway: Vehicle of Dream

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