Diff between gen 1 and 2

wweens · 01-26-2009, 04:55 PM

I'm looking to buy a used one, and I did see an HT for sale for around $2500. He said it had the upgraded Li Ion batteries that had 95% life in them. I didn't ask him the miles on it. What improvements did they make to gen 2 machines? If I want to use an HT to travel trails through a state park will the HT negotiate a relatively smooth trail or should I try to get an offroad model?
Thanks for any info you can provide. It's hard to know the differences in models. It would be nice to have a website that would show all the models, old and new and their plus points and minuses.

Bob.Kerns · 01-27-2009, 12:32 PM

The single biggest difference between Gen1 and Gen2 is the steering. The leansteer steering makes the Gen2 very intuitive to use. Even better, it makes it more stable -- that is, if you get off-balance to the side, say from hitting a bump on that trail, and you keep the leansteer column in front of you, it will very quickly get itself back under you.

Some people prefer the Gen1 because the steering column is rigid, and it helps them balance on the platform. If you need that, it can be pretty important.

The Li-Ion batteries can't be taken on passenger planes, and Gen2 can't use the older NiMH batteries, so that's another reason some prefer the Gen1.

There are a lot of more subtle differences as well, that you can find discussed on many threads here. Some even prefer the older software over the new, because it is a bit more aggressive.

Yes, you can take a non-offroad model off the beaten path. I do so frequently. You do have to be a bit more conscious of the limits -- you have a bit less ground clearance, you're more likely to sink into soft surfaces, or lose traction from loose stuff.

But if you'e not on a steep hill, a bit of loose gravel, or even deep sand, won't stop you, if you take it slow. But a rock big enough to hit your battery bottom in the middle and high-center you, will cause you to lose control, or a steep hill with loose sand or gravel. In fact, other than having a bicyclist fall on me, those represent the only two falls I've had in about 1600 miles. (And I was deliberately pushing the envelope at the time, just to learn what to watch out for).

In fact, after I fell on the dusty hill, I tried to get up -- and slid down the hill on my hands on knees. (Now THAT did some damage! The fall itself didn't hurt me at all.) So the Segway actually did better on that terrain than I did.

Still, I avoid steep slopes with loose stuff. Steep slopes and pavement is not an issue at all. (Ice and snow would be another story).

For most people, the drawbacks of the X models, with their wider size (wider than a lot of doors) and less-than-friendly appearance indoors and on sidewalks, and in many places, their less-friendly legal status, far outweigh the advantages off-road.

But they definitely have their place.

CovRob · 01-27-2009, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wweens

... It's hard to know the differences in models. It would be nice to have a website that would show all the models, old and new and their plus points and minuses.

If you look at pages 18-22 of this "Unofficial Segway Code" pdf compiled by Gareth you'll see a pretty comprehensive summary of the various models and features. Hope it helps.

SegNerd · 01-27-2009, 09:23 PM

I'm inexperienced, so correct me if any of the following are wrong. In addition to the things already mentioned:

-Gen1s use three different keys for low, medium, and high speed. Gen2s have a single key (or multiple copies of a single key) and let you choose the speed via the interface.

-Gen1s don't have a speedometer, clock, or odometer available to the rider... I believe Gen2s do have these (although you can accomplish these three things with a GPS).

-Gen2s have more detailed error reporting on the built-in screen, so if something goes wrong, you have an increased chance of identifying, and possibly fixing, the problem yourself.

-Most Gen1 models shipped with NiMH batteries, although some Li-On upgrades were available. Gen2 models come with Li-On.

jryan · 01-27-2009, 11:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SegNerd

I'm inexperienced, so correct me if any of the following are wrong. In addition to the things already mentioned:

-Gen1s use three different keys for low, medium, and high speed. Gen2s have a single key (or multiple copies of a single key) and let you choose the speed via the interface.

The infokey as found on the gen2's cannot change the speed. The only speed changing you so on the gen2 key is by putting it in turtle mode (limiting the speed to, I believe, 6mph or taking it off turtle mode with a speed limit of 12.5). On a gen2 you use the leaning of your body back and forth to change the speed between 0mph and 12.5 mph. The keys on the gen1's just set your maximum speed as well! You cannot adjust your speed on a gen2 using the key. It is all done by your body, however speed adjustment is something most get used to fairly quickly!

Jeremy Ryan

segsurfer · 01-27-2009, 11:14 PM

See this thread:http://forums.segwaychat.com/showthread.php?t=18453
-segsurfer

SegNerd · 01-28-2009, 01:33 PM

Well, I didn't actually say you could change the speed on a Gen2 with the InfoKey... in fact, my point was that you can't. I just said that you use other aspects of the user interface to adjust the speed on a Gen2, which was an admittedly vague description because I don't own, and haven't used, a second-gen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jryan

The infokey as found on the gen2's cannot change the speed. The only speed changing you so on the gen2 key is by putting it in turtle mode (limiting the speed to, I believe, 6mph or taking it off turtle mode with a speed limit of 12.5). On a gen2 you use the leaning of your body back and forth to change the speed between 0mph and 12.5 mph. The keys on the gen1's just set your maximum speed as well! You cannot adjust your speed on a gen2 using the key. It is all done by your body, however speed adjustment is something most get used to fairly quickly!

Jeremy Ryan

Gihgehls · 01-28-2009, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jryan

The infokey as found on the gen2's cannot change the speed. The only speed changing you so on the gen2 key is by putting it in turtle mode (limiting the speed to, I believe, 6mph or taking it off turtle mode with a speed limit of 12.5). On a gen2 you use the leaning of your body back and forth to change the speed between 0mph and 12.5 mph. The keys on the gen1's just set your maximum speed as well! You cannot adjust your speed on a gen2 using the key. It is all done by your body, however speed adjustment is something most get used to fairly quickly!

Jeremy Ryan

You're just misunderstanding what he wrote. Turtle mode was what he was talking about.

jryan · 01-28-2009, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gihgehls

You're just misunderstanding what he wrote. Turtle mode was what he was talking about.

Yes, so easy to say after he responds with a clarification, don't you think! Your timing was a bit off Gihgehls!

Jeremy Ryan

KSagal · 01-28-2009, 02:32 PM

None of the keys mentioned ever change speeds.

Speed is changed on all machines, in all modes, by simply how far you lean... If you lean more, you go faster, if you lean less, (closer to standing straight up) you go slower or stop...

In any machine, with any key, you can change your speed by your amount of lean from 0 to 5 mph...

In Gen 1, with the black key, or in gen 2 in turtle mode, you can change your speed from 0 to about 6mph

In Gen 1, with the yellow key, you can change your speed from 0 to about 9 or 10 mph.

In Gen 1, with the red key, or in Gen 2 (not in turtle mode) you can change your speed from 0 to about 12.5 mph...

The keys do not change the speed, they simply set the maximum speed that the machine will allow.

01-26-2009, 04:55 PM	#1
wweens New Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: north Texas Posts: 4	Diff between gen 1 and 2 I'm looking to buy a used one, and I did see an HT for sale for around $2500. He said it had the upgraded Li Ion batteries that had 95% life in them. I didn't ask him the miles on it. What improvements did they make to gen 2 machines? If I want to use an HT to travel trails through a state park will the HT negotiate a relatively smooth trail or should I try to get an offroad model? Thanks for any info you can provide. It's hard to know the differences in models. It would be nice to have a website that would show all the models, old and new and their plus points and minuses.

01-27-2009, 11:14 PM	#6
segsurfer Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Harrisonburg, VA Posts: 1,357	See this thread:http://forums.segwaychat.com/showthread.php?t=18453 -segsurfer __________________ Life is not a Roadrunner cartoon, and you are not the Roadrunner!. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

01-28-2009, 02:32 PM	#10
KSagal Glides a lot, talks more... Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Pelham, NH, USA. Posts: 10,356	None of the keys mentioned ever change speeds. Speed is changed on all machines, in all modes, by simply how far you lean... If you lean more, you go faster, if you lean less, (closer to standing straight up) you go slower or stop... In any machine, with any key, you can change your speed by your amount of lean from 0 to 5 mph... In Gen 1, with the black key, or in gen 2 in turtle mode, you can change your speed from 0 to about 6mph In Gen 1, with the yellow key, you can change your speed from 0 to about 9 or 10 mph. In Gen 1, with the red key, or in Gen 2 (not in turtle mode) you can change your speed from 0 to about 12.5 mph... The keys do not change the speed, they simply set the maximum speed that the machine will allow. __________________ Karl Ian Sagal To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. "Well done is better than well said." (Ben Franklin) Bene factum melior bene dictum Proud past President of SEG America and member of the First Premier Segway Enthusiasts Group and subsequent ones as well.

01-27-2009, 12:32 PM	#2
Bob.Kerns Advanced Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Marin County, CA Posts: 3,783	The single biggest difference between Gen1 and Gen2 is the steering. The leansteer steering makes the Gen2 very intuitive to use. Even better, it makes it more stable -- that is, if you get off-balance to the side, say from hitting a bump on that trail, and you keep the leansteer column in front of you, it will very quickly get itself back under you. Some people prefer the Gen1 because the steering column is rigid, and it helps them balance on the platform. If you need that, it can be pretty important. The Li-Ion batteries can't be taken on passenger planes, and Gen2 can't use the older NiMH batteries, so that's another reason some prefer the Gen1. There are a lot of more subtle differences as well, that you can find discussed on many threads here. Some even prefer the older software over the new, because it is a bit more aggressive. Yes, you can take a non-offroad model off the beaten path. I do so frequently. You do have to be a bit more conscious of the limits -- you have a bit less ground clearance, you're more likely to sink into soft surfaces, or lose traction from loose stuff. But if you'e not on a steep hill, a bit of loose gravel, or even deep sand, won't stop you, if you take it slow. But a rock big enough to hit your battery bottom in the middle and high-center you, will cause you to lose control, or a steep hill with loose sand or gravel. In fact, other than having a bicyclist fall on me, those represent the only two falls I've had in about 1600 miles. (And I was deliberately pushing the envelope at the time, just to learn what to watch out for). In fact, after I fell on the dusty hill, I tried to get up -- and slid down the hill on my hands on knees. (Now THAT did some damage! The fall itself didn't hurt me at all.) So the Segway actually did better on that terrain than I did. Still, I avoid steep slopes with loose stuff. Steep slopes and pavement is not an issue at all. (Ice and snow would be another story). For most people, the drawbacks of the X models, with their wider size (wider than a lot of doors) and less-than-friendly appearance indoors and on sidewalks, and in many places, their less-friendly legal status, far outweigh the advantages off-road. But they definitely have their place.

01-27-2009, 09:23 PM	#4
SegNerd Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Portland Posts: 672	I'm inexperienced, so correct me if any of the following are wrong. In addition to the things already mentioned: -Gen1s use three different keys for low, medium, and high speed. Gen2s have a single key (or multiple copies of a single key) and let you choose the speed via the interface. -Gen1s don't have a speedometer, clock, or odometer available to the rider... I believe Gen2s do have these (although you can accomplish these three things with a GPS). -Gen2s have more detailed error reporting on the built-in screen, so if something goes wrong, you have an increased chance of identifying, and possibly fixing, the problem yourself. -Most Gen1 models shipped with NiMH batteries, although some Li-On upgrades were available. Gen2 models come with Li-On.

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