Does anyone else get sucked in?

[KSagal]

There are times when we, as a forum, do a nice job of letting many voices reflect their opinions, and we all agree to dis-agree.

There are other times, when someone says something so outrageous, that we cannot keep from reacting...

At that point, a decision needs to be made... Do we allow this bore to have the last word? Do we allow the outrageous comment to go unanswered? Or do we react...?

A major problem with forums like this, is so many can be so paper tiger-ish, they can be so forceful sounding, without much consequence, because they are anonymous (they make up a name and post under it). IF there were a bit more awareness of whom we speak to on this box, people may act differently...

Anyway, from time to time I find myself defending my right, and the right of others to say a contrairian thing, or for that matter, anything at all.

I have found myself spending good time trying to defend other time spent, and other comments made. Eventually, there becomes a point of diminishing return, and you can no longer spend good time to defend bad...

On several occasions I have been counseled to let the liars have the last word. Let the people who bait just have the last comment. Let the false accusations go unanswered. I have received this kind of advice from friend and foe.

I have a difficult time with this. I see a lie unchallenged like an unmade bed, or an unpacked parachute. It's very nature of existence belies the fact that there is another chapter, another event that must occur to complete the action...

I finish most every book I start, even the bad ones. I do not walk away in the middle of a song, (usually) or in the middle of someone's sentence. I know that some others must suffer from some of these same maladies as I. I just wanted to ask if anyone understands some of these demons?

Keep in mind, that many will feel that I am the Bore at the end of a post, or that my posts need to be not allowed to go unanswered... I understand that. This is not about if this emotion exists, but what to do about it...

[wwhopper]

The key is to learn from the experience. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

Being able to walk away from the "bore" as they no doubt have already shown their true colors to pretty much everyone else, is something can be done, having the last word is something you have to deal with on your own.

The little ignore button on this software can be a very nice thing to use.

Sadly the moderators never get to benefit from that nice feature!

[Bob.Kerns]

Originally Posted by wwhopper

The little ignore button on this software can be a very nice thing to use.

You know, I can't locate that button anywhere. There have been a couple times I've wanted to tell someone about it.

I'm pretty good at doing it manually, though.

[wwhopper]

Originally Posted by Bob.Kerns

You know, I can't locate that button anywhere. There have been a couple times I've wanted to tell someone about it.

I'm pretty good at doing it manually, though.

Can I block posts, emails and messages from specific users?
If there are particular members that bother you and you do not want to see their posts or receive Private Messages and Emails from them, then you can add these members to your 'Ignore List'. There are several ways to do this:
Through your User Control Panel: User CP, Settings & Options, Edit Ignore List. Then, click on their name and choose: User List, Add to Ignore List
What if I see something offensive?
You will find 'Report' links in many places throughout the board. These links allow you to alert the board staff to anything which you find to be offensive, objectionable or illegal.

[KSagal]

maybe it is the optimist in me, but I do not use a device like an 'ignore' button...

I have some people whom I rarely agree with here, but I do not recall any that I never agree with.

I feel that there is always a potential to learn, to expand my horizon, to grow. I would not want to truncate another's words unless I read them first, and decide their worth to me.

I am sure we can learn that those against us are not really so against us, and those that antonize may have a noble cause, deep down.

Personally, I believe less is learned from ignoring someone than from arguing with them. At least with the argument, there is a potential for a better tomorrow. To ignore their point will not likely gain anything for anyone.

I have yet to meet the person who has absolutely nothing to bring to the room...

[Gihgehls]

Sometimes you have to ask yourself which you prefer more: Seeing truth win or seeing peace win.

[Bob.Kerns]

Originally Posted by KSagal

I have a difficult time with this. I see a lie unchallenged like an unmade bed, or an unpacked parachute. It's very nature of existence belies the fact that there is another chapter, another event that must occur to complete the action...

I think we have to leave the (metaphorical) bed unmade, and spend our efforts on making sure the parachute is properly and safely packed.

It's this need to "SAY something" that drives the continuation of the spiral. Sometimes you have to consciously decide whether you really want to go where the spiral goes. Sometimes, speaking out is a moral imperative. Usually not on internet forums, however.

Sometimes, when we post, we expect a certain outcome, a certain reaction. When we don't get it, it can be disconcerting. Often, we feel a certain loss of control. Sometimes people respond by trying to control the debate -- dictate what can or cannot be discussed, etc.

I'm not saying that's always wrong -- I recently encouraged the death of a thread, if you'll recall. But sometimes it leads to hurt feelings, or even further tangents and loss of control.

To not post, is to relinquish control. But the thing to remember is -- it was only an illusion. When we post, we have no control over where the conversation goes from there. It's a risk we take when we post. Some people are unwilling to take that risk, or are willing only in certain environments.

Since I think we do want wide participation, we do want to be an environment generally comfortable for people to post. We also have to balance that against the risk of over-constraining ourselves, so we can't post what we think, narrowing the discussion excessively.

But I don't think there's a social solution to comfort in NOT posting. I think we have to arrive there individually, and on a case-by-case basis.

[Chipster]

At first I thought I was being a little uptight...but in a recent post Tarkus post a cute comic representation of the Tortoise and the Hare (I liked it so much I saved it). Some time later he re-posted the comic with a handicapped placard...again cute.

It wasn't until I right-clicked on it to 'save-as' and noticed the file name 'Turtleharecrip' whereas the original was 'Turtlehare.'

Again, I took a deep breath, checked my point-of-view...and then asked myself...if this forum is to be a open dialog...open opinion forum...then I must say my peace.

One can only assume the 'crip' suffix to the filename can only reference a cripple (as it relates to the handicapped placard). I for one use my Seg as an adjunct to get around because my legs don't always do what I want them to.

Additionally, a chat site that has a dedicated forum to 'Special Needs, Mobility and Disabled Use' should moderate posts like this (or a least post-issue remediate).

I agree with Karl...it is easy to get sucked in...have feelings hurt...have opinions stifled...and egos bruised.

I further commend Karl for raising the question and agree that an ignore button is not the solution...but neither is ignorance.

Just my 2 cents.

[Bob.Kerns]

Originally Posted by Chipster

It wasn't until I right-clicked on it to 'save-as' and noticed the file name 'Turtleharecrip' whereas the original was 'Turtlehare.'
...
Just my 2 cents.

Thank you for your two cents. We're all two virtual cents richer for your contribution. (Metaphor, genuine thanks, NOT sarcasm).

I think we often place too much significance on a word.

A group of Americans used to be called by a word that I won't even abbreviate, such is its history of abuse.

Then, many decades ago, they campaigned to be called by another word, based on the color of their skin. Fine, I agree, that was an improvement. And it helped highlight that the only fundamental difference was purely a surface feature of no import.

But oddly enough, the old word meant the exact same thing, being derived from the word for that color in another language. The difference was pretty much two factors -- shedding the disrespect associated with the old word, and gaining the respect of people using a self-chosen word that people are more comfortable with.

Then people decided, for reasons I don't know, they wanted to be called by their supposed continent of origin, combined with their current one. A step back, in my opinion -- it's not always accurate and fails to accurately capture the distinguishing difference of the group. But it's not my opinion that matters in the slightest, so fine.

Such is progress, and one of a very small number of cases where I think changing the language really did make a difference.

But the odd thing is, some members of this group CALL EACH OTHER with the original word, with all its hateful connotations. And it's considered (by many, at least), to be OK. Certainly, its connotations are different when used that way.

Similar, perhaps, to ethnic jokes told by members of that ethnicity, or lawyer jokes told by lawyers. I'm not judging.

I think the analogy here is clear. The question is, to what degree should we consider "cripple" to be a verboten term. I think the history of discrimination against the disabled pales in many ways against other past histories. Is this word really so contaminated with misuse and abuse that we should take offense for its mere use, assuming disrespectful intent? Even when the person using it is a member of the group?

Personally, I chose not to take offense here. There are enough things to be offended by with more substance.

But it's a fair feeling to express, and thus a fair question you raise.

Sorry for the length; I trust you understand why I'm careful in my wording here.

[KSagal]

I am sorry it took so many words, even though I know why.

I believe that these days we have to bend over backwards in an effort to not offend, and even go so far as to choose our words so that even portions of them will not come back as damaging...

All that said, I think the cartoon and it's modified version came from a man who tirelessly advances the causes for the disabled. He does not in any way strike me as a person who would deride a group, any group, and especially that one which he himself is a member...

I believe this is a simple case of a pot calling a fellow kettle black, and not intending any harm.

That is at least, how I interpret what is going on...

And a good point worthy of discussion and clarification.