SUGGESTED CHANGES TO i2 SEGWAY
 

It's hard to find a thread that discusses suggested changes that SEGWAY INC. should be considering, so I chose this one.

Below is a copy of an email I sent to SEGWAY customer service last week. Don't know if there will ever be an answer, but it was worth a try.

Any comments from members of this group are welome.

RAY-NER

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Dear Judy,

During our phone conversation of Wednesday, I
mentioned a few possible feature upgrades to the Model
i2 that will improve user safety AND convenience of
loading the Segway into a vehicle.

A) User Safety

When moving forward at moderate speed and the wheels
are elevated if they encounter an unexpected speed
bump OR any rise that causes the wheels to loose
traction, the rider can be thrown from the Segway.
There should be an immediate shutdown that stops the
wheels from rotating when there is no pressure applied
to the Segway platform when the rider falls to the
ground and his body is no longer applying pressure to
the Segway platform.

This feature is required in order to stop the wheels
from turning if one of the rider’s feet is trapped
between the mudguard and the console.

However, when the Segway is not in motion and the
rider is stepping off the platform, the shutdown
occurs in the normal fashion by pressing the shutdown
button on the infokey. The foregoing shutdown is
recommended only when the Segway is in forward motion.

B) Loading the Segway into a vehicle with a hatchback lid.

In order to use the power of the i2 Segway to load it
into a vehicle using ramps, currently it is nearly impossible to go up the ramp using the power of the wheels in motion.

The reason is that in order to go forward (up the ramp)
the wheels have to move forward. To cause that to
happen, the bar must be positioned at an angle that
basically causes the Segway’s wheels to move backward. To do this, the bar must be tilted in the same direction as lifting the SEGWAY over a curbstone in the riderless mode. It is then impossible to enter the
vehicle because the bar strikes the hatchback lid.
In addition, controlling the Segway in this fashion is extremely difficult.

In order to properly load the Segway using a ramp, the
wheel motion has to be reversed temporarily in order
for the user to be able to stand behind the Segway and
guide it up the ramp using the bar in a position to
have very slow speed as it goes up to the edge of the
hatchback opening. In this way, the user has total
control as it goes up the ramp and enters the vehicle
without the bar striking the underside of the
hatchback lid.

Upon shutdown using the infokey, the reverse format is
cancelled and the normal startup method prevails
thereafter.

To reverse the order of motion in order to navigate
the loading ramp, the program would be initiated by
the user simply by pressing two buttons on the infokey
simultaneously for three seconds. One of the buttons
is the startup key and the other is any one of the
remaining three keys as your software designer
chooses.

I'm missing something - see below:I don't understand how this would happen

how would the glide know the difference between falling off and stepping off? I can't get a mental picture of what you are describing...I load my i167s all the time into my suv by a rather steep ramp (two tin hurrican shutters cut to 3.5' at a roughly 45 degree angle) and it requires no effort whatsoever, power assist does 100% of the climbing. I tilt it as its rolling up and in, and once its all the way in I shut it off and put my styrofoam scuba tank stops under the wheels and I'm off.

You are talking Gen1 and he is talking Gen2. Although there is power assist in Gen2 it does not work like Gen1 and isn't as functional when going into / out of a car.

Steven

I don't understand what you are getting at with the first suggestion. Are you saying that the segway should shut off if it goes airborne while carrying a rider? I fail to see how shutting down in this situation would keep the user safer than if it just went on balancing.

thank you I figured they were the same. why would they change that I wonder?

local help
 

Rayner, during my next trip into LA I'll stop by and address some of your concerns in person. Sometimes things get sorted out much quicker in person. A demonstration is worth a thousand words, eh?

(Now if I also take this opportunity to put a polo mallet in your hand, don't be surprised! 8^) 8^) 8^) Feel the balance....notice how it almost seems like an extension of your arm!)

ps - If you don't mind telling us, who'd you buy your i2 from? Any dealer should have handle a fair number of these questions/issues.

+++++ Your i167 has the power assist feature which i2 does not. The i2 will travel backward in the balance mode if you tilt the bar backward as the i2 is in the same position as when you stepped off. In order to move forward, you must tilt the bar forward to slowly move the i2 up the loading ramp. This is where the difficulty lies. Imagine where you must stand in order to guide the i2 up the ramp under this scenario. Besides that, the bar must be used to guide it up-ramp until the handle bar collides with the hatchback lid. This is a very difficult loading procedure as you can envision. Therefore, for ease of loading, the order of direction must be temporarily reversed as described.
++++++++++++++++++++
RAY-NER

+++++++++ I think I indicated that the shutoff must occur if the rider's feet are not on the platform while the wheels are still turning. In my spill, my left foot was off the platform and my right foot was caught but not pressing on the platform, so the switches under the pad were not depressed on either side. See my reply to Bill Paxton.

RAY-NER

++++ In your city of Santa Barbara, the Segway dealer is Jerry Mahoney whom I trust you know very well. I did not discuss this with him in advance of my submission to SEGWAY, INC., but he has an email copy of it.

RAY-NER

+++++++++++++++++++

Ray-Ner

Excellent thoughts, well presented...

I might offer some considerations...

ON your concept of an immediate shut down, based on forward motion and no rider detects...

Many times I ride, and a void comes upon me... I consider a void the opposite of a bump. (A pot hole, a drop off a curb, the far side of a speed bump, etc) and when encountering those times, the segway can fall away from my feet, for a very short time. (Less than a second) If the shutdown were to occur at times like that, when I landed on the seg, it would have the tires going too slow, and my forward momentum would cause a 12 mph faceplant. I believe this to be worse than your mishap.

Regarding your mishap, I read your account of the event, and have a question and a guess, followed by a suggestion...

You stated that the wheels still had forward motion, and that the left wheel was off the ground. From your description, you were on the ground as well. Since only one wheel was on the ground, and both were spinning, long enough for someone nearby to run to your aid, I wonder why the seg was not traveling in circles? It must have had the left (airborn) wheel spinning and the right wheel skidding on the pavement.

You may or may not know, the segway will do an immediate shutdown if tipped over too far sideways. It seems to me that your machine must have been very close to falling over sideways as it was, all you had to do was lay it over the rest of the way, and it would have done two things... your foot would have come clear, and the machine would have shut down right away...

On your second concept of having a power assist, similar to the gen one machines, but in reverse of the standard lean=direction...

Using your plan, you engage your lean forward, move backward plan, you lean the leansteer a bit towards yourself as you stand behind your machine, as it is at the bottom of the ramps. It starts up the ramps...(So far I am with you) ... As the machine goes further up the ramp, the lean on the machine increases till the machine is basically horizontal when it is fully in the car... With your plan, as the seg climbs the ramp, and the lean steer is closer and closer to horizontal, the seg will increase in speed. By the time the seg base gets to the top of the ramp, it would be entering the car at 12 + mph! I would think this requires a very large foam pad at the seats...

What I do with my i2... (By the way I have an e-167 and an i2) with the i2, I use riderless balance mode to start the seg about 6 inches to a foot up the ramp. I then shut it down, while behind the seg, and just lower the leansteer frame to horizontal, and push the seg into the car like I would a lawnmower...

One thing that I have found, the transisition from the pavement to the ramp with no power is fairly hard, and much harder than just climbing the ramps, so I do not power down on the ground, but first make that transition from level pavement to inclined ramp, before I start using my own arm power...

I have also seen tapes of, and heard of others removing the lean steer frame, or the top half of it, depending on the size of the car, and then letting just the frame climb the ramps while in balance mode, without the leansteer frame... The base is well balanced, and will do this with no problem...

I do not remove the leansteer frame mostly because I am too lazy, but also because I have an SUV that I use...

I hope some of my considerations will add to your view on these topics, and you should try some of my suggestions, and they will hopefully serve you well, as they have done for me...