Single wheel Segway?

[charmed]

European patent link posted by Baantjer on another thread. Check out the drawings, the answer to my long sought monowheel segway!

http://ep.espacenet.com/search97cgi/s97is.dll?Action=View&ViewTemplate=e/gb/en/viewer.hts&collection=dips&SearchType=3&VdkVgwKey=EP1208032A1



Also by Baantjer, a link to the same patent at the canadian site:

http://patents1.ic.gc.ca/details?patent_number=2382360&language=EN_CA

this one worked much better for me.

I haven't been able to see all the pages yet, and would very much like to post the drawings in the 'photo album'. [edit--looks like Casey is on it. Check his photo album for drawings].

The one drawing of the gentleman astride the articulating seat/single wheeled scooter is something I have pictured (hoped for) for a long time, and I believe it could be part of what so excited the investors. Could it be what Metcalf was referring to when he said that Segway wasn't the IT he was talking about? Hmmmm......

[Casey]

Photo Album-Casey-Patent Drawings-Articulated Seat

Frank

[charmed]

Nice picture of a motorized unicycle here:

http://vernonalee.com/honeymoon/nz1.html

Change the gas IC engine to electric motor, add Segway-type DS, and oh Boy!

[charmed]

Another interesting link, this time to a radio controlled single-wheel that some kids made.

http://www.boltontech.org.uk/loony_cycle.htm

[Pappy]

Charmed - where have you been? These single wheeled versions have been around for a very long time.

I believe these weird versions are the Metcalfe and Kemper versions of "IT"
Can you picture them seeing a single wheeled unicycle that requires no balance and turns a zips like nothing they've ever seen before (retorical)

Aside: Can you imagine never having to charge your Segway? Just get on it and go endlessly whenever and whereever you want? I think that is Kamens vision.

[ftropea]

Hey, I'd put the odds that Kamen's got a one-wheeled Segway in his secret lab somewhere at 90-1 in favor.

Now, whether or not that'll be the consumer version we'll be riding around on is another story. Although, one does wonder... why the one-wheeled version for consumers and the 2-wheeled version for commercial use?

[charmed]

"why the
one-wheeled version for consumers and the 2-wheeled version for commercial use?"

I doubt it is as simple as that. If Segway has plans to market a one-wheeled version, I doubt that it would be anytime soon. The whole safety-first aspect of their current efforts is not without serious considerations. I would think that for introductory purposes, whether commercial or consumer, the current models or something as fool proof are the way to go.

I also strongly suspect that IF there is a one-wheeler in the works, that it doesn't come close to current models in terms of lateral stability, at least at low speeds. At higher speeds, I am inclined to think that single wheels could be MORE stable than transverse double's. Once the sidewalks are won, the streets and bikepaths will be much simpler to address.

I'm still having problems imagining lateral DS for a one-wheeler. I can imagine flywheel/gyros (ala Gyrocar), or tilting the wheel and shifting the base (piezo gyros sending impulses to linear tilting servos), but it all seems rather complicated, especially in light of the elegant simplicity of the current models.

My guess is IF they or someone else markets a single wheel version, it will likely be undynamically stable relative to latitude, and rely on the rider's natural balancing abilities, possibly coupled with helper ground contact members when necessary. Above a few miles an hour lateral DS doesn't seem worth the trouble or weight.

[baantjer]

Doesn't the legislation explicitly mention 2 in tandem wheels?

That would make a single wheel version illegal on the sidewalk.

[Pappy]

quote:Originally posted by baantjer

Doesn't the legislation explicitly mention 2 in tandem wheels?

That would make a single wheel version illegal on the sidewalk.


Good question Baa. I hope someone knows the answer to that one.

---

NOTE TO FRANK AND ALL - (sorry to go off topic briefly, charmed):
Damn, it kinda sucks to have to log in just to be a lurker. I understand your reasoning most likely, but remember, there is a huge difference in people who just want to lurk (and that includes the general populace of newcomers as well as old timers I'm sure), and people who troll.
Anyway, I like to peruse without logging in. Granted, being forced to log in just to read is your perrogative (screw the spelling), but if you are going for a more exclusive membership, then that's cool.

Ok, back to the one wheeled wonder and baa's question:

So if the 2 wheeled Segway is accepted state by state, will a 1 wheeled wonder be legal as well? How many other steps would then be needed to get the one wheeled wonder going? The same amount of time it took for the current version?

So, good question and good topic to discuss.

[ftropea]

Pappy,

At first the site was only open to the developers. Then we opened registration to the regulars and now the general public. We haven't even hit the search engines yet, so anyone coming over here is most likely from TIQ - or heard about the site from there... or perhaps DC :)

As time goes by, I think we'll probably allow lurkers. But for now, this is soley a participation site so our members are being encouraged to participate. We haven't had any problems thus far and things are going really well. I'm not going to fix what ain't broken yet... Some tweaking may be in order, but I'm working on it as I find the time :P

Back to the topic!!

The laws I've read seem to describe a 2-wheeled version and don't seem to cover one-wheeled or uniball versions. That's my opinion.

- Frank

[charmed]

IF there is a one-wheeled version in the works, I would imagine it is destined for the domain of bikes and mopeds. I would expect it to be faster (by necessity), less stable, more sporty over-all. We have yet to see any patents that point to lateral DS for a single-wheeled device, although we have seen drawings of single-wheeled devices. I'm guessing that a single-wheeled would rely on a rider's balance, at least at low speed, and therefore would be a poor fit on the sidewalks. On the otherhand, it would arguably be more stable than the current offerings at speeds above 12 mph.--easier to recover from irregularities in its path, able to input sharp lateral leans, potential to hop down off of curbs at speed, etc.

The current segways are designed for pedestrian co-mingling at their core, and are geared, literally, for the sidewalk. A single-wheeled device would be geared toward bikelanes and the street, IMO.

[baantjer]

quote:Originally posted by charmed

<snip>
We have yet to see any patents that point to lateral DS for a single-wheeled device, although we have seen drawings of single-wheeled devices.
<snip>
Patent application http://patents1.ic.gc.ca/details?patent_number=2382360&language=EN_CA does mention:
quote:
Personal vehicles may be self-propelled and user-guidable, and, further, may entail stabilization in one or both of the fore-aft or left-right planes, such as when no more than two wheels are in ground contact at a time.
<snip>
Appropriate force transducers may be provided to sense leftward and rightward leaning and related controls provided to cause left and right turning as a result of the sensed leaning. The leaning may also be detected by proximity sensors.
<snip>
It is to be understood that within the scope of the present invention,..., wheel 32 may rotate about a single axis, or, alternativly, about an axis that may vary in orientation, in the manner of a uniball

[charmed]

Thanks, baantjer. I remembered that, but I didn't see it as a concrete scheme specific to single wheel. It refers to sensing the rider's lateral lean for instructing the vehicle to turn, but it also mentions
"no more than two wheels", which I took to mean it referred to the control, and not stability.

The uniball wouldn't need to distinguish between lateral and longitudinal behavior to balance with just a single contact point. And it isn't hard to envision such an idea as do-able. But the uniball design seems just too darn complex and troublesome for the kind of daily driver that I think would be practical. I'd love to be surprised and learn that Segway has overcome the obvious issues with riding atop a ball (bearings, keeping the wheel clean, transmission, etc).

When I look at what they have done with the Segway, I can't help but think that future models will be similarly straightforward.

I don't mean to say that lateral DS isn't possible, just that I doubt that the first single-wheeled DS scooter would incorporate it.

[Blinky]

Check out an old Ducktales(disney cartoon) character, I used to watch this show all the time not to long ago [8D]


http://www.lambdapsiphi.com/daft/daftsupp/art/gizmo.gif


GizmoDuck

[Blinky]

I don't know how many of you actually seen this cartoon before, but what is interesting about it is that the inventor of this body suit is an inventor that worked for Uncle Scrooge named "Gyro Gaerloose".

[Blinky]

Maybe we can expect this to be announced tomorrow on GMA? ;)

What ever the news tomorrow, it should be good. After all its coming from Segway LLC.