canada

[pt]

i fear that canadians might see a ban before the hts even go on sale there. kinda like san fran, ca- usa.

why?

rentals.

in seattle, wa a ban was placed in an area when a rental shop opened up across from the busiest recreational park in a busy area of the city, there were also complaints that multiple rental places were riding around in parks "advertising".

on the canada front, according to andrew mellenger, the fellow who created "andrew the segway monster" video, he rented a ht in vancouver. according to a web site which did a review of the rental service, you watch a video and get 15 minutes of training...then, it's yellow key time in vancouver.

http://www.voltage-ev.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=7&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

in the video andrew says this is what was going on:
"The exercise we were doing was to teach aggressive stopping. He wanted me to come at him as fast as I could (with the black key) and then stop as fast as I could. It was probably my 5th attempt, and he wanted me to be more aggressive each time. I wasn't trying to overdo it but I definitely was trying to put myself in a position that was not natural, i.e. really letting the machine hold me. I think it did work correctly".

so far, there's been a video made by someone who rented the ht showing a safety shutdown / crash (as it was titled) and andrew (same fellow who made the segway monster video) reports he is making a new one "How to ride no hands, one foot", I have it mastered now".

if you're goverment official and you knew all this, what is the easy thing to do?

sorry folks, i usually never post doom and gloom.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[dhugger]

What i still dont understand is why "agressive stopping" was even touched upon. Why in the world wouldn't the instuctor just say "Go slow, so you don't have to stop agressively. Stopping too quick can be dangerous." It would have kept that vid from being made and it would save all of us a lot of trouble. Personally, I think this whole HT rental thing is a bad idea. Until (good) laws are established, no more renting! All it does is let people who wanna get a try without buying go nuts. If people are really serious about trying an HT without buying one, all they would need to do is contact Segway LLC or anyone here @ Segway Chat.

-Derek Hugger-

[BruceWright]

Sit-stop is the only quick stopping motion I teach. Anything else is asking for trouble. I do plan to show the Andrew video to my friends if they start to act up.

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

[dhugger]

Oh yeah, one more thing...to anyone thinking of banning the HT because it's "dangerous," ask yourself the following:
How many times did you fall off a bike before getting it right?
How stable where you when you learned how to walk?
How long did it take you to lean how to drive a car?
How many cities have banned cars, bikes, or walking b/c it's unsafe?

-Derek Hugger-

[pt]

derek- agressive stopping is cool and extreme, when you pay for $20 for a rental that's what it's all about baby! extreme segwaying.

ya know what's not fun? going slow, not catching air, not showing off. $20, ya gotta get your money's worth! who would ever watch a video of someone using the ht properly? boooorrrinnng. in fact, the safety video is "dull" according to the rental review site, but that 15 mimutes of training will make up for it. and then, it's yellow key time.

when the ht is positioned a recreational thing, people want to get radical as andrew said in his note to me "It was my first day on a Segway and I was really excited to see the limits of it". i don't blame them, heck when you an INSTRUCTOR show you agressive riding.

i predict a ban in vancouver within 30 to 60 days and it will be spawned from the rental biz.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[pt]

okay-

let me add to this, the segway place in vancouver did not show the safety video. according to someone (andrew) who rented from there.

to recap. 15 minutes, and in some cases, no video.

yikes.
yikes.
yikes.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[sfh1790]

Rental schemes by unthinking business owners could go a long way towards undoing Segway, LLC's careful lobbying and investment.

If it is true that Segways are sold with a "may not rent" clause in the purchase agreement, I would expect Segway, LLC's lawyers to send "cease and desist" letters to rental companies as soon as they appear. This is a very common occurance in business.

Does anyone know if the "may not rent" clause is a reality?

sh
sheng@drizzle.com

[BruceWright]

I didn't sign one when I bought a Segway. I didn't sign anything.

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

[pt]

i think segway will not sell you a ht willingly if you say "i'm gonna buy a bunch of these to rent them to people". it's hard to stop people from buying anything, the best you can do is not let them if they say "hey, i'm going to do something with this that you don't want me to".

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[pemond1]

Hi PT and all ..

Here's an article which appeared in the Ottawa Sun yesterday. Comments? I'm trying to decide if I should go out and get a ticket just to challenge this in court. I don't see how you compare the Segway with a "motorized scooter for kids". Ottawa is supposed to be such a "green" city you think they would welcome this non-polluting method of travel.

http://www.canoe.ca/OttawaNews/os.os-05-29-0010.html

UPDATE: Sorry, they removed the link ... here is a link to a JPG scanned version of it.

http://www.comprez.com/segway.jpg

-----------------
Paul Emond

[pt]

paul-

that link seems to be broken.

but even without seeing a story, here's the deal-- segways are sold to canada and they're not on the law books (yet). i think you'll lose any court case and that could be really bad and could shape a ban.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[larryKay]

"but even without seeing a story, here's the deal-- segways are sold to canada and they're not on the law books (yet)."

Here in New York, there are no laws permitting the use of a Segway and we certainly are buying them and using them. Fairly soon, there will be laws as they become more high profile....

Larry

[sfh1790]

Bruce -

I don't think you have to sign anything to be bound by a usage agreement with a manufacturer.

For example, if you buy a movie DVD, I'll bet you are prohibited from showing (effectively renting) that DVD in a theatre and making money from it.

A similar rule applies to software, although the manufacturer typically has you click a button to show that you've read the agreement. Which nobody does...:)

sh
sheng@drizzle.com

[pt]

larry-

i think the problem is, you (or this fellow) will lose any court case if you get a ticket in a place like new york or other areas that do not have this on the books...and then after that, you'll see laws that basically ban them.

boy, i'm all doom and gloom today.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[pemond1]

Sorry ... Looks like they removed the link. I've posted a jpg copy of the article at ...

http://www.comprez.com/segway.jpg

-----------------
Paul Emond

[pt]

that's pretty accurate, if you want to use the segway ht in canada legally, gotta get the laws going.

cheers,
pt



======================

segway ht journal:
http://www.bookofseg.com

other stuff:
http://www.flashenabled.com

[Vansegway]

quote:Originally posted by pt

okay-

let me add to this, the segway place in vancouver did not show the safety video. according to someone (andrew) who rented from there.

to recap. 15 minutes, and in some cases, no video.

yikes.
yikes.
yikes.



Please check your facts! I have been there many times, I know more people than I can remeber that rent scooters from the place in Vancouver..and all of them were shown the video and AT LEAST a 15 minute training exercise. One person I saw when I was there was not doing all that great for some reason..and the trainer was with him for more than 25 minutes before he was satisfied.
And what exactly is wrong with renting?? Because of the action of a few stupid, immature people..people should not be able to rent them in vancouver or anywhere else..because they MAY be banned? They definately will not..at least in Vancouver.

"i predict a ban in vancouver within 30 to 60 days and it will be spawned from the rental biz."

umm..excuse me mr moderator..your 30 days are up, and "I PREDICT" that they will not be banned in another 30 either...or anytime for that matter. The rental place is doing great, the people who rent them are happy and safe, and the neighbourhood is happy as well. so stop the doom and gloom as you call it.

[st7860]

vancouverboy probably doesnt realise the segway doesnt qualify under the scooter/electric laws(so its illegal in bc) which state that the maximum motor power is about half a kW. i think the segway is at least a kW or more.

[Vansegway]

quote:Originally posted by st7860

vancouverboy probably doesnt realise the segway doesnt qualify under the scooter/electric laws(so its illegal in bc) which state that the maximum motor power is about half a kW. i think the segway is at least a kW or more.


and what bs7860 probably doesn't realise is that they are not legal, but not illegal either. ALL of the vancouver city council recently tried segways, including the mayor of vancouver. They all liked them, and had nothing but positive things to say, and they passed their observations and recomendations on the the bc government and icbc. The mayor is hopeful that they will evaluate the segway and implement laws that will make it legal on sidewalks and citystreets.

[wheels]

quote:Originally posted by pt


sorry folks, i usually never post doom and gloom.

cheers,
pt


NOT TRUE pt, you usually post doom and gloom. Your main problem is 'Doom And Gloom'. With you, "Every silver lining has a cloud around it" .
-------------------------------
Example: Segway LA is merrily planning our get together and you come along with: "i'm a bit scared to even bring this up...

parks are a sensitive subject for cities in regards to the ht. if you plan to have a lot of people in the park with segways, you might want to get approval or work with the city.

just a suggestion, i'm trying to work with my city now and i can tell ya that parks are well, very different than other things.
------------------------------
THAT'S DOOM AND GLOOM pt !
You bring to mind; A person who took a headache tablet and... sure enough they got a headache.

FYI' We have between 25-30 Park Rangers coming over to our site to get demo's. They were the ones who asked if they could come and visit us... I did NO sucking up.

Listen to yourself when you sign-off with "Cheers"




"Life's a wheelie when you're on a Segway"

[st7860]

what vancouverboy isnt telling you all is that the local cops sometimes give tickets for riding regular unpowered scooters, let alone a 1.5kw segway!!!

[Vansegway]

quote:Originally posted by st7860

what vancouverboy isnt telling you all is that the local cops sometimes give tickets for riding regular unpowered scooters, let alone a 1.5kw segway!!!


I don't know where you get your information BS7860 but that is completely untrue!!!!! And by the way, on Sunday when I rented the Segway again, there was an off duty police officer there who was ahead of us and was renting one, as well as a security guard from a local store on granville island who wanted to rent one when we came back.

[st7860]

vancouverboy probably doesnt realise the segway doesnt qualify under the scooter/electric laws(so its illegal in bc) which state that the maximum motor power is about half a kW. i think the segway is at least a kW or more.

[mekki]

There is no question: The Segway is absolutely not legal on the road or seawall, and in the opinion of the police and city engineering staff, is also illegal on the sidewalk. Just becuase people use them and are not getting ticketed does not make them legal, just tolerated. Ever seen people smoke crack in front of the police station at Main and Hastings?

Where things get really sticky, and potentially very ugly, is when an accident does happen. Legally, what will happen when a Segway renter gets t-boned by a Hummer on Fir St? What happens when someone gets injured by a Segway rider on the seawall?

In the first instance, the Segway is not supposed to be on the road (even crossing the street while riding is being "on the road"), so how will ICBC address this, even if the Hummer was totally at fault? In the second case, the bylaws state that (paraphrased) "No motorized vehicles, (except wheelchairs) are permitted on any path adjacent to the water", so it would seem that the Segway rider has no case if the injured party were to sue.

I'm not saying any of this is right, but this is how it is.

[st7860]

vancouverboy probably doesnt realise that if he has the same attitude toward a cop if he gets stopped on the street as he does HERE on this board, he will probably get a nasty ticket.

[Montrealrentals]

Hey Everyone,
Not everyone is dong it the wrong way in Canada. We are working with the provincial transport minister and local police to inform them and make srue that laws are put into place alllowing for the Segway in Quebec (and elsewhere in Canada). We really stress to our guests that when they rent from us they are all Ambasadors of Segway here in Montreal. For more info on how rental biz shoudl be done check out my posting under Montreal Rentals or check out our web site at:

www.segcanada.com

Ride safe, Ride fun Ride the Future



Jeremy Hill
General Manager

Location SEG! Rentals
Ride the Future TODAY!

Ph: 514-393-0734
Fx: 514-393-2734
www.segcanada.com
info@segcanada.com