Does anyone know what this means?

[KSagal]

Someone decided on Christmas Eve to send me a negative rep point, and this was in the comments section.

I have tried what meager translation matrixes I have, but to no avail...

Someone has gone to great lenghts to try to be cryptic, so if anyone out there can find a translation, or is willing to, I would appreciate it.

Perhaps this person is not a coward at all, but just confused.

FInally, of course, this may be very personal, since I do not know who sent it or why, but that is a risk that I am willing to take, as a personal comment from a person without the integrity to identify themselves has no real value to me.

我的媽和她的瘋狂的外甥都

Thanks,

[Desert_Seg]

...
FInally, of course, this may be very personal, since I do not know who sent it or why, but that is a risk that I am willing to take, as a personal comment from a person without the integrity to identify themselves has no real value to me.

我的媽和她的瘋狂的外甥都

Thanks,

Karl,

Wasn't me and I can't read Kanji so I can't help you there. However, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, let them post anonymous negative comments all they want...just don't worry about it.

Most of us know what kind of person you are...and respect you for it.

Steven

[nickyboy]

Karl,

Wasn't me and I can't read Kanji so I can't help you there. However, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, let them post anonymous negative comments all they want...just don't worry about it.

Most of us know what kind of person you are...and respect you for it.

Steven

I'll second that.

Karl, I don't think your the kind of guy to loose sleep over this. Kick back, blow out your candles and chill.

[wwhopper]

May be giving those who are tossing unidentified neg points at you their "jollies."

Karl, any relationship between your commenting on the negative comments, and the neg points themselves?

Say you comment on the point system on 12/23 and then you get neg points on 12/24. I think the points can directly be tied to a specific thread, maybe not a post, so that would at least be a good start. What threads/posts have you gotten positive points for, and what posts have you gotten negative points for?

Karl, also remember that you a person who is very well known in the community, and some might say "out spoken," so you are more visable, thus more open to comment. So at least you know you are being heard, since there are members who are responding, nameless or not.

Maybe we should request that all rep points be cleared as of 1/1/08 and then go from there. Giving everyone a fresh start on the new year!

This point system reminds me of beining in high school, there were always those kids that were popular, then the rest of us! But you look now at the popular kids, they have careers flinging burgers, a mess of kids and are living in a run down trailer park (well at least that was what I saw at my high school reunion.)

[KSagal]

Karl,

Wasn't me and I can't read Kanji so I can't help you there. However, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it, let them post anonymous negative comments all they want...just don't worry about it.

Most of us know what kind of person you are...and respect you for it.

Steven

I'll second that.

Karl, I don't think your the kind of guy to loose sleep over this. Kick back, blow out your candles and chill.


Aw shucks... Thanks. I would give you guys points, but I can't. It is really nice to get comments like this. Thank you.

Actually, I appreciate these comments, but would not give rep points for being nice to me. (Although it is human nature for a person to feel more favorably toward a person who is not outwardly hostile than to a person who is...)

I really do not loose sleep over this person, or much of what happens here...

I offer it as a reflection in concert with what Polo is doing. He has stated that he is trying to make this a more friendly and cordial place to hang out. All I am saying is that cheap shots taken out of sight at this forum contributes to the degredation of this forum, and to the fact that people get fed up and leave. Any person here who has been attacked behind the scenes will know what I am talking about...

Some of the posts here are kind of like that smile that you get from the car salesman when you walk in. Some of us are also interested in what is said about us in the showroom, while we are out walking in the lot. That is what is going on behind the scenes, like on the reputations points board...


And Will,

I do know that I paint a big target on myself often. These buzzng little gnats that take cheap shots mean nothing, and I do know it. If you say that I am feeding their need by outing their otherwise secret activities, that may be so, but I do not care. Satisfying the needs of vermin does not rank high on my lists of things to do, so if I incidentally do it, so be it. Outing despicable behaviour ranks higher on that list.

I do appreciate your efforts to have me be more introspective. Your suggesting it has merit to me, because your opinion has merit to me.

I do and did consider my posts, and if I 'went too far' or something like that, but while that is a valid consideration, the bleeting of these cheap shot artists is not.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

[gbrandwood]

It means "I think you're a really great guy but can't work out how to give positive rep points". That's my poor translation. ;)

Seriously, Karl, Will has it right. Don't even give those who dis you the limelight they crave.

If you copy and paste your message into google (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=%22%E6%88%91%E7%9A%84%E5%AA%BD%E5%92%8C%E5%A5%B9 %E7%9A%84%E7%98%8B%E7%8B%82%E7%9A%84%E5%A4%96%E7%9 4%A5%E9%83%BD%22&meta=), it gives something like: "Holy Mother of God and her crazy nephews", or maybe just the latter half??? Of no help but it suggests to me that not only is the person not giving their name, they're using a language which isn't their first. Just guesses though. My reply is also adding to the "jollies" this person might be getting so I'll stop

Keep your upper lip stiff old boy.

[CovRob]

AltaVista-Babel Fish (http://babelfish.altavista.com/) translation offers this when traditional Chinese to English is requested:

"My mother and her crazy sister's sons all" :confused:

:cool:

[polo_pro]

Karl, also remember that you a person who is very well known in the community, and some might say "out spoken," so you are more visable, thus more open to comment. So at least you know you are being heard, since there are members who are responding, nameless or not.

Maybe we should request that all rep points be cleared as of 1/1/08 and then go from there. Giving everyone a fresh start on the new year!

I agree with Will on this. But I'd build on his suggestion with a sticky posting that the moderators MAY reveal anyone giving negative rep points. I happen to know that the moderators can easily determine exactly who makes ANY comment. This may cut down on the sniping that some are concerned about.

My feeling is that long standing respected members (like Karl) will naturally rise in rep. Sure, there may be some folks who sling neg rep occasionally. But I'd like to think that if everyone got in the habit of handing out more pos rep then getting neg rep would only seem like a blip, eh?

Besides if I'm wrong and things get out of hand, the moderators can turn off all rep with just a flick off the switch. So how about it? Zero everyone's rep (including my hard earned points over the last few years), and if by June things haven't turned out like I describe above then we just turn off the rep system? I'd like to see it run "naturally" for a while, but after that I won't care so much if it's turned off.

ps - Again, I reiterate that I think as the system is zeroed, that the moderator should make a sticky describing how to give rep (perhaps just cutting and pasting one of my posts from the Devolution thread) and state clearly that anyone leaving neg pos anonymously runs the risk of being revealed by the moderator.

[macgeek]

I don't agree with alot Karl has to say,
BUT I think that to just neg with no reason just to be spiteful is childish and uncalled for.

I added a + to karl's rep as a retaliation of that reprehensible behavior.

I suggest everyone do the same

Jonathan

[citivolus]

I would wager it is from a Firefly/Serenity fan or someone who copied and pasted from a signature somewhere. I can tell you that it is not someone who speaks Chinese. I would guess the original started with "Mother of God" or "Oh my God" but it's pretty far gone. At least they didn't cut and paste 青蛙?#!@&睾丸。 which has to do with frogs and tender regions of the male anatomy.

[wwhopper]

And I got two negs with no signature or comments either....

And the positives all have nice comments, thanks!

[segsurfer]

one good deed deserves another, words to live by
-segsurfer
BTW, like the signature

[KSagal]

I don't agree with alot Karl has to say,
BUT I think that to just neg with no reason just to be spiteful is childish and uncalled for.

I added a + to karl's rep as a retaliation of that reprehensible behavior.

I suggest everyone do the same

Jonathan


While I appreciate Jon's outrage on my behalf, I do not wish to have people do anything to my rep points on this issue.

I just wanted to point out that disbursing positive points will only make the front room of this forum a friendly place. If the cheap shots keep coming from behind the dumpster out back, then many here will still either leave, or not speak their minds for fear of a nuke.

As far as giving me points, positive or negative, they should be directly related to the things I say, not the things some silly coward said to me.

I am sure I often say things that make people want to give me a negative point. If it is done honestly, so be it. I like it to be signed, but if not, and there is an intelligible comment, I will not complain.

I am also sure that occasionally, I say something that may be worthy of a positive point. IF this occurs, I request the same conditions.

So, Thank you Jon. But I must ask that people do not do his suggestion.

[polo_pro]

Too late...you've got more pos rep. Now next time someone anonymously neg reps you, you can thumb your nose at them and know their slight has already been countered.

[jgbackes]

Interesting, I just noticed I have a Multi-byte rep post as well.

老朋友，你看起來很有精神。・老朋友，你看起来很有精神。
"Lao pung yo, nee can chi lai hun yo jing shen."
"You're looking wonderful, old friend."

It's kinda fun tracking this stuff down when you don't speak the language!

[macgeek]

IF - U - CN - READ - THIS - MESSAGE - YOU - CAN - WORK - AT - WOKDONALDS

I guess Monster.com is trying to target a new group of candidates.

Moderators do we have a Rep Troll on the loose????

[JohnG]

Indeed, admins do know who gave what to who. But that's to ensure no one member is abusing the system and just handing out across-the-board positives or negatives. I can say in Karl's case, that is not the case -- the people who have given him neg reps have also given neg and positive reps to other members, so there's no clear pattern of abuse or targeting.

The rep system is based upon the "wisdom of the crowds," and therefore, in balance, if someone gives you a neg rep, it's not really going to affect your score long-term if you're a positive contributing member of the community (and most people recognize that).

John

[KSagal]

Just to re-iterate, I was not complaining about the red dot. That and others may very well be deserved from time to time. I surely understand that I often have the minority position on many topics.

It was the cheap shot I was talking about. There is a tremendous difference between mature disagreement, and a sneak hit.

Lastly, I have far more positives than negatives. I did not mean for this to go this far. I am very used to cheap shots from a few members of this forum. That is life.

I am no angel myself. I have been known to lob a bomb from time to time as well. The only difference is that if I have a problem with someone, I bring it up to their face, never behind their back. I am opinionated and a bit of an a$$ sometime, but never a sneak.

So, with that, I respectfully request that this thread be locked.

[jryan]

Maybe the admmins should consider adding a neutral rep point category. I think sometimes there are things that are neither positive nor negative but you would like to comment on for the poster. Neutral may work well!

[macgeek]

Karl,
you opened this can of worms, so now you have to go fishing.
i don't think the thread should be locked, because you don't like the direction it is headed in.

the moderators, will have there own say

Jonathan

[Mr_Laurenzano]

I just found out we had rep points.
I swear on both my mothers.
Crash:eek:

[polo_pro]

i don't think the thread should be locked

Seconded. No one's been rude, no one's been personally attacked, heck I'm not sure there's even a big debate going on.

ps - jgrohol, thx for stepping in and giving us a peek behind the scenes. It really does help when you bring speculation to an end with cold hard facts.

[Desert_Seg]

...It really does help when you bring speculation to an end with cold hard facts.

Come on! Since when have let pesky things such as facts get in the way of speculation? :D

Steven

[BillK]

Facts? Facts? We don' need no steenkin' facts!

I have given up on trying to give out rep points - the system keeps telling me that I have to give other people some points before I can give them to this person again - I have given out LOTS of rep points and now cannot give them to anyone anymore because the system will not let me.

Lets see - we have on average let's say 30 posts per day - of these there are maybe 20 active posters - of these only 5-10 have anything good to say that I think deserves any rep points - and these are the SAME people each time - so I am stuck - I quit trying to give them out anymore.
:confused:

[polo_pro]

Facts? Facts? We don' need no steenkin' facts!

I have given up on trying to give out rep points - the system keeps telling me that I have to give other people some points before I can give them to this person again - I have given out LOTS of rep points and now cannot give them to anyone anymore because the system will not let me.

Lets see - we have on average let's say 30 posts per day - of these there are maybe 20 active posters - of these only 5-10 have anything good to say that I think deserves any rep points - and these are the SAME people each time - so I am stuck - I quit trying to give them out anymore.
:confused:

How many pos rep are you giving out at a time? I'm giving out a couple each day. And for that reason, I think I spread them pretty evenly. I've only had the "you can't give rep to this person until you spread around more" twice this week.

But hey, I do appreciate you trying!

ps - I do seem to be getting alot pos rep in return, maybe that somehow factors into things?

[nickyboy]

Facts? Facts? We don' need no steenkin' facts!

I have given up on trying to give out rep points - the system keeps telling me that I have to give other people some points before I can give them to this person again - I have given out LOTS of rep points and now cannot give them to anyone anymore because the system will not let me.

Lets see - we have on average let's say 30 posts per day - of these there are maybe 20 active posters - of these only 5-10 have anything good to say that I think deserves any rep points - and these are the SAME people each time - so I am stuck - I quit trying to give them out anymore.
:confused:

Want to trade? ;)

(Its a JOKE everyone, don't got getting all wound up!)

[BillK]

OK - I give up - I have tried and tried - I cannot give anyone any rep points period. (I have not tried on people that I do not agree with what they are saying or are saying mundane things <grin>.)

It never says that I have to GET some rep points before I can give them out - it says that I have to spread them round some more before I can give any more out.

For example - I tried to give some to Nickyboy and it refuses... and POLO as well... and Desert Seg... well you get the idea - it sounds like a good system but in practice it falls over.

Perhaps the moderators could look at who I have tried to give them to and how many I have actually given out and see how close I am to being able to give out more?
Bill

[quade]

OK - I give up - I have tried and tried - I cannot give anyone any rep points period.

Face it, the Rep system is simply broken.

I'm not so sure it's even a good idea in the first place. Look at what it's done to poor Karl. He is the proud past President of SegAmerica, but reduced to, well, for lack of a better term, whining about some anonymous person(s) giving him "bad rep" on an internet chat site. I don't really understand why he cares anyway. People that take anonymous snipes are simply cowards. Once you understand that, who give a flying fig?

For the record, I have never given a "bad" rep point to anyone on this web site. Seems rather pointless.

[bentbiker]

OK - I give up - I have tried and tried - I cannot give anyone any rep points period. (I have not tried on people that I do not agree with what they are saying or are saying mundane things <grin>.)

It never says that I have to GET some rep points before I can give them out - it says that I have to spread them round some more before I can give any more out.

For example - I tried to give some to Nickyboy and it refuses... and POLO as well... and Desert Seg... well you get the idea - it sounds like a good system but in practice it falls over.

Perhaps the moderators could look at who I have tried to give them to and how many I have actually given out and see how close I am to being able to give out more?
Bill
Bill,
I think it was previously explained that if you give a point to Steve, you cannot give him another point until you have give points to 10 other people.

[BillK]

AHHHH! TEN people - ok - I missed the number part - I knew I had not done it ENOUGH - just was not sure how many enough was. :)

Thanks - I obviously to not agree with enough DIFFERENT people to be able to make my vote count :D
Thanks

Bill

[wwhopper]

I have been giving more rep points lately than I ever did before.

[KSagal]

For the sake of Polo, I offered a bit of commentary on the snakes who use the back door to take cheap shots.

Steve (polo) has been trying to make the best of this flawed system. I believe that he feels that if enough people comply with it's inane rules, it will eventually be a better (more accurate?) source of information for newbes.

He may be right to some degree. I am surely willing to give him the benifit of my doubts. Mostly because I want to support his efforts than because I agree with him.

I do not care about a negative point at all. I have gotten cheap shots almost from the day I joined this forum. (And I have gotten them from some surprising places, and from people who make believe they are not doing it.) This is not about negative points or points.

If a person is going to attempt to start a movement to be more civil and cordial on this forum, then uncivil and discordial behaviour has to be vetted.

Painting the front room over and over, but leaving the back room full of snakes does not make the two room apartment a good place to live.

From my perspective, the foundation is flawed. It is still flawed, regardless how much effort goes into making the drapes look good. Unless you fix the foundation (cannot point who you want, some people can change their own points, some people can and do change other people's points, and no one knows who has has what manipulated) then any building on top of that foundation will also be flawed...

Let's consider for a moment, that even though we know that the system is no good, several moderators have already said they choose not to change it, and Steve has said he wants to do this or that...

So, let him paint the front room, and hang new drapes. He will be happy, and the front room will look better, till the house falls down. It does not hurt me, and it does make Steve happier, and he feels it makes the place a better place till it falls.

I trust his judgement, and happily support his efforts. It matters not that I would not do it, nor believe it matters to me.... The fact that it matters to Steve (polo) is enough for me...

[Desert_Seg]

I find it so funny that we are really wasting so much time on this topic.

I agree with Karl, if you don't have the guts to identify yourself when you post a comment than why bother posting it at all.

I disagree with Steve (polo) that the system is a good one and can be used for good.

Regardless, I read them all, ignore the ones I don't like, chuckle at the funny ones, and don't worry too much about the negative ones.

All should do the same.

'Nuff said....

Steven

[gbrandwood]

For Karl, simple solution: we get the mods to turn the vBulletin option on that automatically identifies users who leave rep points.

The system is what is - good, bad, whatever you care to think of it. It'll never be perfect but I support Polo in his efforts and think the system is more good than bad. We don't all consider it a bad system. Like, Steven, I enjoy reading them - the good the bad and the ugly. I guess some of us have more reading to do than others :rolleyes:.

[polo_pro]

Gareth/gbrandwood, I like the way you put things up above. You described the whole situation well. And I want to add that I don´t care what the next step is, so much as that we try something. We can zero everyone?´rep. We can have all comments automatically include the authors name. Whatever folks want to try....but let?´do something so the rep mechanism can help improve things around here in SC.

ps - Steven/desert_seg, I treat the comments exactly as you describe. Lots of funny ones in there (especially Mr L´s), some that make me think and any anonymous neg ones probably aren´t even worth reading. I do hope people start thinking of rep like this....there´s no reason to get bent out of shape over the occasional random anonymous insult.

[BillK]

Rep points system be HANGED! Rep points to polo from me. The $#%$^%$ system will not let me do it but #$%%^^$%# I am doing it anyway - since the people in charge of this carzy thing can't seem to fix it - I have given out rep points till I am BLUE in the face and it still will not let me give any to anyone that I have EVER given rep points to. So - POLO - here are some more from me.
Bill

[polo_pro]

Rep points system be HANGED! Rep points to polo from me. The $#%$^%$ system will not let me do it but #$%%^^$%# I am doing it anyway - since the people in charge of this carzy thing can't seem to fix it - I have given out rep points till I am BLUE in the face and it still will not let me give any to anyone that I have EVER given rep points to. So - POLO - here are some more from me.
Bill

I just pos repped you. Try one more time...maybe it has something to do with me giving rep points to you before you try?

[gbrandwood]

We can zero everyone?´repYou could set up a poll to get a feeling for this idea. It would be unfair to do it without a consensus of opinion from the board.

[KSagal]

THe Moderators have already been asked to look into this, and had been fairly clear that they can, but choose not to change anything.

That position may have changed, but this is a privately held site, and is not a democracy. Wanting something is not the same as having the ability to get something.

[BillK]

I just pos repped you. Try one more time...maybe it has something to do with me giving rep points to you before you try?

Nope - I cannot give you any rep points - It tells me that I have to spread them around to others first.

I understand that you do not want someone's "friend" to camp on their rep points button - so you have to give them out to others as well. But - come on - can you seriously tell someone that they have to agree with a lot more people before they can give positive assent to the ones that hey really agree with? :confused:
Bill

[gbrandwood]

THe Moderators have already been asked to look into this, and had been fairly clear that they can, but choose not to change anything.

That position may have changed, but this is a privately held site, and is not a democracy. Wanting something is not the same as having the ability to get something.If a poll revealed a significantly high number of members wanted something to happen, I think the minds of the mods could be persuaded. You're right, they don't have to do anything. BUT, it is in their interests to improve the board for the better - so I imagine they'd be inclined to go with the judgement of a majority of board members. It remains to be seen, however.

Some suggestions are acted upon immediately because they are good ideas. Others might take a little more work.

[polo_pro]

So start the poll, Gareth. I'll happily support zeroing all reps despite having the most to lose if it happens. I may be industrious when it comes to handing out pos rep (because I feel its the best grassroots way to change the atmosphere here in SC), but when it comes to "instigating" I'll leave it to others to organize. I've had my hand slapped too many times here in SC, and people would claim I'm biased on this matter (and pushing an agenda too hard).

[gbrandwood]

Done: http://forums.segwaychat.com/showthread.php?t=17445

The yes's have it! So far... ends in one month.

[Desert_Seg]

Yes the "yes" is still in the lead...doubling the "no" vote.

Steven

[JohnG]

Unless you get a few hundred members to respond to this poll, it's not going to be any sort of representative sample of our membership. As a biased, unrepresentative sample, we are unlikely to act on whatever its outcome.

Online reputation systems are, by design, imperfect and can never realistically portray the real world. The one we have works as designed, as it allows people to give their honest portrayal of other people's posts, without fear of retribution. That is, I believe, the way it should be.

John

[Desert_Seg]

...it allows people to give their honest portrayal of other people's posts, without fear of retribution. That is, I believe, the way it should be.

John

What retribution is there for putting your name on a comment you make to a users post?

I see no reason why a comment to a post should not be "signed". While this allows the commentator to be identified it in no way takes away from the system.

Also your statement that we need a couple of hundred votes is erroneous. There are maybe (maybe) 50 "regular" posters (by regular I'm talking who post more than once every two months). So, if you get 25% of them who vote, you have a representational amount.

Steven

[JohnG]

Reputation does not equal "comment."

And trust me when I say there are more than 50 active members here. Not everyone who's active posts.

[polo_pro]

Reputation does not equal "comment."

And trust me when I say there are more than 50 active members here. Not everyone who's active posts.

Is it fair to say there are more than 50 members who've used the rep system in the last month? What about the last 3 months?

I can see both jgrohol's and desert_seg's point of view. Having anonymity does enable feedback that might otherwise not be given. But having authors names automatically included in a comment tends to make sure people's comments don't cross the line.

[quade]

. . . to make sure people's comments don't cross the line.

Who's line?

I've known people in life that can't tolerate -any- form of criticism or negative feedback what so ever and on the flip side of that, I've been paid quite a bit from time to time to be brutally honest about my opinions because the people that did so valued that from what they could learn.

Much of what I've said on this web site is no more or less honest than feedback I give on design projects day in and out on a regular basis, but, like I said before, some people just can't tolerate any view point that varies from their own and they also tend to be the same people that get really vindictive when it comes to "getting even" (as if that's actually possible) via rep systems. Yet, due to bias inherent in the system, the popularity and longevity of posting by an individual usually is what it actually boils down to.

Anybody that seriously crosses the line will eventually be dealt with by the moderators, so that isn't really a very good motivation to use any rep system. Again, using it to "get even" with somebody you simply disagree with is just stupid. In my opinion, what rep systems should be used for is identifying the people with the most accurate information, NOT the most popular or sympathetic due to some strange set of circumstances or history.

[Desert_Seg]

Who's line?

I've known people in life that can't tolerate -any- form of criticism or negative feedback what so ever and on the flip side of that, I've been paid quite a bit from time to time to be brutally honest about my opinions because the people that did so valued that from what they could learn. ...

Hey! I resent that remark.

Just kidding :D

...In my opinion, what rep systems should be used for is identifying the people with the most accurate information, NOT the most popular or sympathetic due to some strange set of circumstances or history.

BINGO! The rep system isn't a popularity contest, it is a source of information on the quality (value) of the posters.

Steven

[Desert_Seg]

...And trust me when I say there are more than 50 active members here. Not everyone who's active posts.

I disagree with you there. An ACTIVE member is one who posts. If you don't post you are a LURKER and not an active member of a forum.

Based on your answer my guess is that there are a lot less than 50 ACTIVE members.

Can you tell us how many unique members have posted in the last 30 days?

Steven

[KSagal]

I believe it is fair to say that more people have used the rep system as a result of Steve's (Polo) actions. If activity on that count alone is inportant, this current trend of the last couple weeks should not be considered representative, especially since if that system is not made fair, it will soon drift back into the snipe hunt it has traditionally been.

For the plan of zeroing out all the rep counts, one may want to consider that the top 5 point holders all have access to manipulate their own points and eveyone elses as well. I am sure it just a coincedence.

When a person suggest that everything be set back to zero, it has the largest advantage for the person who is closest to zero, and the largest disadvantage for those furthest from zero.

So, I ask, what is the advantage of setting back the counters for those at the top of the heap?

I feel compelled to also state here, that not everyone who has the ability to manipulate the rep points is in that top 5. I do not know who has the capacity, or who has been assisted or held back, and do not really care. But I believe it has value to know that some people have chosen to not place themselves at the top of the page.

Lastly, I invite people to see the older threads about problems with this rep system, or even my own post # 38, then read John Grohol's posts again. His title speaks louder than I could to describe what his attitude is regarding having others tell him (and the other mods) how this site should be run...

[Five-Flags]

... The one we have works as designed, as it allows people to give their honest portrayal of other people's posts, without fear of retribution. That is, I believe, the way it should be.

John

John, I agree completely that that is the way it should be.

IT IS NOT !!!!

There are a limited number of individuals on this chat who have most generously shared their time and ingenuity to bring us a particularly interesting post or innovative idea. NOT (currently) 6,296 brilliant members. I was online last July 14th, when we had the highest number of users online (455). Believe it or not, even THEY were not ALL extraordinary users. In my (not-so-humble) opinion, there are only a few dozen (at most) that I consider have consistantly brought significant value to this forum.

Not to diminish the value of most posters. The dialog and interplay and even a question that may not have ever been asked in a particular way before, all add value and encourage information exchange.

I don't have to name names; I guarantee that you and Pam and Sal could probably each write a list of twenty-five names and the lists would probably match at least twenty-two of the names, although with perhaps a slight change of order. If you're honest with yourself, I suspect you'll agree.

Now, here I am. I have just read an extremely informative post, complete with video, that solves a problem that has existed since Ginger first danced in New Hampshire. Can I reward this ingenious member? Can I "give their(my) honest portrayal of other people's posts"??

NO NO NO NO NO!

This system has determined that every individual's posts are all equally worthy, and I must take my recognition of the extraordinary nature of some efforts and scatter it to the winds; obviously, I must be extremely arrogant, or just plain bigoted, to think that some posts are more worthy of recognition than others. (Why does Ayn Rand come to mind???)


Therefore, until some unknown number of others earn a rep point from me ( or I just start awarding indiscriminate rep points that devalues them into wind-borne chaff ), I cannot award my rep point to any of the select few that I feel have earned that recognition.

So the result is a system

that steals from the deserving

for the benefit of the unearned.

The individuals to whom I refer, (and I hope they all know whom I mean) have exceeded the norm many, many times, but they are robbed of the multiple rewards they've earned, by this vBulletin system and the choice of parameters by the moderators.

That's MY opinion...[:(!][:(!][:(!]

[bentbiker]

Am I the only one frustrated by the fragmentation of this thread?

We have a group of people who feel the system is bad because moderators have the ability to adjust rep points. Why would I care unless I had points taken from me? I haven't heard anybody complain about losing points, and I don't see any of the mods bragging about their levels.

Another group feels all points should be readjusted to zero. As Karl pointed out, that, in and of itself, serves no useful purpose that I can see.

There is a group of very vocal objectors who feel any negative points should have a name associated with it. What possible use would I have for that information other than retaliation. It would reduce the number of negative points issued, but should I want that censorship? Personally, if I've given out really bad info (or attitude), I'd like to know it, because that's not what I'm about. Numerous people have said that they aren't bothered by such dings, and then they follow with paragraph after paragraph of name calling aimed at anyone having the nerve to disagree with them. I do admit that comments attached to negative rep points that are made in foreign languages (assuming it's not the native language of the poster), seem to be justifiable cause for the mods quietly putting somebody on moderation or issuing a warning and reversing the point if that is important to the recipient. The issuer of such a negative point cannot be attempting to improve anything, and retaliation should NOT be condoned.

Finally there are those who feel only a half dozen posters are deserving of points -- ever. They want the system to be changed so that they can reward only posts made by that small fraternity. I feel they've lost sight of the purpose of this system -- to reflect the reputation of the poster for giving good, accurate, information -- not necessarily provided momentous new information. If someone gives accurate detailed answers to newcomers, I think there reputation should reflect it. It shouldn't be said that they contributed nothing earth shattering.

I think John Grohol's post was right on target and I wouldn't want a moderator's hat on this board for any amount of money . . . unless it was a lot of money.:D

[macgeek]

Name Posts
_______________
Dragan 652
RAG1247 983
QuadSquad 347
macgeek 2,698
Brooster 4,000
wwhopper 2,907
bystander 1,939
Desert_Seg 2,207

Just a sampling of the top 8 USERS
(I ignore admin's reps. 'pt' who has not posted here in 2 years, has a "extremely high rep")

The Post / Rep ratio is DEFINITELY skewed to more likable / less liked members
(note karl is #12 with the Highest postings of 4,223 posts)

So based on This little research (even though I like having such a high rep)
I agree that the rep should be reset to zero and we should get a more accurate 'feel' for members.

Jonathan

PS: don't I deserve a rep point for my clear and unbiased opinions (evil laugh)
;) ;) ;) ;) :)

[JohnG]

Mods do not nor have they ever altered rep points of individual users.

Users who want to sign their points comments can and many do. Nothing prevents people from taking credit for their comments.

Some issues, like not being able to give more points to the same person time and time again, are easily adjusted. I've changed the variable so now you can give more points to the same user after giving to only one other user (it used to be 20).

J

[KSagal]

Mods do not nor have they ever altered rep points of individual users.

Users who want to sign their points comments can and many do. Nothing prevents people from taking credit for their comments.

Some issues, like not being able to give more points to the same person time and time again, are easily adjusted. I've changed the variable so now you can give more points to the same user after giving to only one other user (it used to be 20).


J

I believe that Pam had posted that an individual's points were changed at one point. People who have never posted on this site, since the change, have very high rep points, even though there was no such system in place the last time they posted.

[BillPaxton]

I've changed the variable so now you can give more points to the same user after giving to only one other user (it used to be 20).

J
That is a great decision IMHO. I've wanted to give people concurrant +R's on different threads, but in order to recognize them I've actually gone out and +R'd others in order to get back to them and give them more (not blatantly just handing points out but definitely seeking any excuse to rep someone new so I could give the deserving points).

[wwhopper]

When you hit the members list, and hit the post list, and compare it to the rep points it is interesting to see who has high rep points for their number of posts

Ignoring the Moderators and owners

The lead in the rep area seems to be:

DRAGAN
RAG1247
QuadSquad
MacGeek
Brooster
WWHopper
And the list goes on…

Below those are some of the posters in this thread names like DesertSeg, Jgrohol, KSagal and polo.

Starting with MacGeek the posts are very high, while the three top rep points are listed with considerably smaller post numbers.

As of yesterday I have 595 rep points to go with my 2907 posts.

I would be interested to hear what the rest of the rep point numbers are.

[macgeek]

When you hit the members list, and hit the post list, and compare it to the rep points it is interesting to see who has high rep points for their number of posts

Ignoring the Moderators and owners

The lead in the rep area seems to be:

DRAGAN
RAG1247
QuadSquad
MacGeek
Brooster
WWHopper
And the list goes on…

Below those are some of the posters in this thread names like DesertSeg, Jgrohol, KSagal and polo.

Starting with MacGeek the posts are very high, while the three top rep points are listed with considerably smaller post numbers.

As of yesterday I have 595 rep points to go with my 2907 posts.

I would be interested to hear what the rest of the rep point numbers are.

Think alike

:)

Jonathan

[Five-Flags]

... Some issues, like not being able to give more points to the same person time and time again, are easily adjusted. I've changed the variable so now you can give more points to the same user after giving to only one other user (it used to be 20).

J

In my oh-so-subtle way, I'll say..

THANK YOU, John!!!

I really appreciate your consideration on this. I think it will be a good change for the rep system, and I rather doubt that it will be abused. Thanks again.:):):)

[JohnG]

Yeah, default settings are not always the best. I wasn't even aware of that limit, as I rarely use the rep system to begin with......

[BillK]

TWENTY? <grin>
Well - I never would have given out that many - I sure am happier with it being ONE.

Incredible - that has remove my gripes with the system. Thank you!
Bill

[polo_pro]

Some issues, like not being able to give more points to the same person time and time again, are easily adjusted. I've changed the variable so now you can give more points to the same user after giving to only one other user (it used to be 20).

Sound great! Thanks for trying something different!! Let's see how things play out...

[polo_pro]

When you hit the members list, and hit the post list, and compare it to the rep points it is interesting to see who has high rep points for their number of posts

Ignoring the Moderators and owners

The lead in the rep area seems to be:

DRAGAN
RAG1247
QuadSquad
MacGeek
Brooster
WWHopper
And the list goes on…

Below those are some of the posters in this thread names like DesertSeg, Jgrohol, KSagal and polo.

Starting with MacGeek the posts are very high, while the three top rep points are listed with considerably smaller post numbers.

As of yesterday I have 595 rep points to go with my 2907 posts.

I would be interested to hear what the rest of the rep point numbers are.

227, but it was about a 100 points less last month. Alot of people seem to approve of my pos rep campaign!

[BillPaxton]

227, but it was about a 100 points less last month. Alot of people seem to approve of my pos rep campaign!here here!