New Zigbee PRO Standard coming...

[Sal]

Since our infokeys use Zigbee, I thought I'd post this (http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/13/zigbee-alliance-clears-the-way-for-new-zigbee-pro-standard/).

I'm not familiar with the ins and outs of wireless, but it should prove interesting for those among us who are so inclined.

Original Article (http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=202401851).

-Sal

P.S. Might future Segways be able to "talk" with each other? Maybe programmed gliding / synchronized maneuvers? Of course I'm daydreaming, but the potential exists for the Mad scientists at the mothership to concoct such things (if not now, soon).

[Jus Sumguy]

...P.S. Might future Segways be able to "talk" with each other? Maybe programmed gliding / synchronized maneuvers? Of course I'm daydreaming, but the potential exists for the Mad scientists at the mothership to concoct such things (if not now, soon).
They already gotta be fartin around with that stuff. For a while now.

Guaranteed.

-

[Desert_Seg]

Couple of things about Zigbee....

1. Very low power transmissions
2. Meant for (primarily) manufacturing processes (or processes that "direct" equipment.

Even with the new Zigbee PRO, which some of us have been watching intently, there is little growth in the Segway "management" arena. So, unfortunately, don't expect any change in the way Segway's communicate, this change doesn't do anything for that.

Steven

[dgbint]

I do not have any inside knowledge.
But I don't think that communications with other Zigbee devices will be possible, nor desirable.

Possible:
It is a bit like saying, with my modern telephone I can call just about anybody on the earth.
Sure I can contact them, but can I successfully communicate with them ?
No !
For communications to work, we need a common language, which depends on both them and me, not on the telephone.

Desirable:
Would you like somebody ( anybody ? ) to be in a postion to 'control' the Segway that you are gliding on ?
Do you think that Segway engineers would design in 'access' like that that could potentially be 'hacked' ?

Michael

[Jus Sumguy]

Wrong!!

I do not have any inside knowledge.
But I don't think that communications with other Zigbee devices will be possible,
Wrong. The possibility is already there. The engineering end of it hasta get by attitudes like this, before it can move along.
nor desirable.Wrong
It is a bit like saying, with my modern telephone I can call just about anybody on the earth.Wrong
Sure I can contact them, but can I successfully communicate with them ?
No !Wrong
For communications to work, we need a common language, which depends on both them and me, not on the telephone.Just about any machine language would work..

Desirable:
Would you like somebody ( anybody ? ) to be in a postion sic to 'control' the Segway that you are gliding on ?If I wish them to. Yes. What I don't want is the likes of the person who makes the uneducated statements which you just made, to be in any sort of a decision making position. (powdered white wig yelling harumph. humbug. the earth is the center of the universe. blasphemy.)
Do you think that Segway engineers would design in 'access' like that that could potentially be 'hacked' ?Hacking it would be awfully hard with a simple bypass switch on the input antenna. Effectivly blocking all access to your electronics through the system.

Oops....Ahhhhh..............Hmmmmm.............

A little bit of knowledge, just enough to be dangerous, and a whole bunch-o-fear are what traditionally hold back progress.

-

[dgbint]

You are a brave man sire !

I am a qualified Electrical Engineer, with many decades of experience and many products under my belt.

I stand beside my comments.

Michael

[polo_pro]

Now if I can only redirect that determined/confident mindset towards polo!

[Five-Flags]

Quote:
Originally Posted by dgbint
I do not have any inside knowledge.
But I don't think that communications with other Zigbee devices will be possible,

Wrong. The possibility is already there. The engineering end of it hasta get by attitudes like this, before it can move along.

Wrong! The Segway uses a modified Zigbee protocol which is unlikely to effectively communicate with standard Zigbee devices.




Quote:
nor desirable.

Wrong
Wrong! Strictly your opinion, not necessarily everyone's.






Quote:
It is a bit like saying, with my modern telephone I can call just about anybody on the earth.

Wrong

Wrong! You're the one proposing open access.






Quote:
Sure I can contact them, but can I successfully communicate with them ?
No !

Wrong

Wrong! What protocol will you use, and what will the Segway feel like sending you?





Quote:
For communications to work, we need a common language, which depends on both them and me, not on the telephone.

Just about any machine language would work..

Wrong! Any machine language that happens to be the one utilized by the Segway processors. If the protocol doesn't match, it is no more than just random RF noise.






Quote:
Desirable:
Would you like somebody ( anybody ? ) to be in a postion sic to 'control' the Segway that you are gliding on ?

If I wish them to. Yes. What I don't want is the likes of the person who makes the uneducated statements which you just made, to be in any sort of a decision making position. (powdered white wig yelling harumph. humbug. the earth is the center of the universe. blasphemy.)

Wrong! When it comes to making uneducated statements, I will grant you are an unqualified expert, but I'd rather have a VERY secure interface with a VIGOROUS safety protocol (which Zigbee does NOT have) before allowing control of a Segway I was riding.

(Elegant stage production) -- ten Segway ballerinas gracefully performing in sync -- when the leader hits a slick spot and we watch ten beautifully synchronized face-plants!






Quote:
Do you think that Segway engineers would design in 'access' like that that could potentially be 'hacked' ?

Hacking it would be awfully hard with a simple bypass switch on the input antenna. Effectivly blocking all access to your electronics through the system.

Oops....Ahhhhh..............Hmmmmm.............

A little bit of knowledge, just enough to be dangerous, and a whole bunch-o-fear are what traditionally hold back progress.

Wrong! A little bit of knowledge, just enough to be dangerous, is usually just exactly that!

I would design a LOT more than a simple bypass switch into any such idea. A few minutes reading NTSB reports will enlighten you to how often a simple little switch called the Landing Gear Lever is forgotten by some very experienced pilots as well as MANY less experienced.

If you're going to entrust your looks and/or LIFE to someone else's control, I highly recommend you make the interface as secure as possible.

But I don't think Inc is going to rush right out and rewrite the machine code in the Segway to accommodate it.
-

[Jus Sumguy]

BwaaaaHaaaHaaaaaa.


You're full of it. Just stinkin full of it. And you know it. http://forums.segwaychat.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

-

[Desert_Seg]

BwaaaaHaaaHaaaaaa.


You're full of it. Just stinkin full of it. And you know it. http://forums.segwaychat.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

-

If full of knowledge is what you are speaking about then yes, both Michael and Five Flags' posts are that.

Of course, your points also have some merit. After all, everything is possible. Some are highly improbably but yes, indeed, they are still possible.

Same could be said of the Segway engineers making a "synchronized" unit. While I'm sure where there are applications where this might be useful (RMP comes to mind), I find it doubtful (improbable) that this will ever be a feature set of a consumer unit. It not only doesn't make sense from a safety aspect, it makes even less sense from a business perspective. Try to make a business case for inclusion and see how quickly you hit a brick wall.

Speaking of brick walls, while it is improbable that you will succeed, you can keep banging your head against a brick wall with the possibility of making a hole. From a safety aspect, it's a no-brainer (pun intended), and from a business sense, well, there are much better tools for the job.

So see, while everything is possible, some are highly improbable, and some just don't make sense.

Steven