The Secret Weapon...

[n/a]

quote:The way we will win is by demonstrating the value it delivers," says Cohen, and while he is correct, the Segway has another secret weapon: it is fun to ride. While all the analysis and time-saving claims may win a few fans, every boast falls far short of the test ride. I can't help but recall Gary Leonard's grin and his, "Oh man. . . Fantastic. . . I want this

We discuss and debate about the practical benefits (time and money saving) of Segway. What we are perhaps underestimating are the emotional aspects involved. As the reporter says in the above quote the fun aspect is way underestimated. At this point Segway LLC has to downplay it because they want Segway percieved as a productivity tool, not a toy. Here is another relevant quote:
quote:I could try to describe the feeling, offering literary allusions, but everything I scribble pales in comparison to what Gary utters when he puts down his camera and steps on the HT. He's smiling giddily, almost guiltily, as he whirls through the room, circling a glass coffee table, easily scooting up a ramp and avoiding a scattering of couches and love seats. He doesn't want to get off.

"Wow," proclaims Gary. "It just won't let you fall over. . . Oh man. . . Oh man. . . Fantastic. . . Can I take this home?. . . I want this. How much is this?

Another emotional motive for buying a Segway is pride/vanity. A business executive that is in a hurry and has to take a long walk from one destination to an other will get all sweaty. A person who sweats and pants gives the appearance of nervousness, and looks and smells unappealing. For some people success has to do a lot with the the way they look. Staying "fresh" is an important factor to them. Segway will help them stay fresh. It will also give middle aged executives a personal boost in another sense. When walking with their colleages, they will be able to set the pace on their Segways and they will hover 6 inches higher compared to their pedestrian colleages. For men this means more than we are willing to admit. Research shows that when to presidential candidates compete for office, usually the taller one wins out. Also looking down to someone gives a psychological edge.

The ladies are even more concerned about their appearance than men. Unfortunately a woman's appearnace is still one of her main assetes. So a lot of woman will want to avoid strenuous walking because sweating makes them look less attractive. Flowing gracefuly along on a Segway will surely appeal to them. I am sure they will find poses that will eliminate any dork factor.
http://www.downtownnews.com/archive/index.inn?loc=detail&doc=/2002/June/07-1082-news2.txt

[Casey]

I have seen reports before saying that appearance, but especially height, gains a person power and position in society as well as business.

One of the Segway detractors favorite arguments is that you look "dorky" on a Segway. To me that is a very feeble argument brought on by a bias on the part of the detractor against Segway itself. I have seen pictures of many people on one, as well as watching them on GMA and other shows. They look no more "dorky" or "geeky" than a bicycle rider.

Many business executive types are gadget fans. And with Segway being the newest and best gadget on the market, I think it will have a lot of appeal to these people. Once the gadget status wears off, it should become as you describe. A fun way to get around without working up a sweat.

Frank

[n/a]

A while back I saw a couple tall powerfully built police officers on Segway. Imagine how intimidating these guys look when u add 8 inches to their height. Nobody would dare to call a cop that looks 7 feet tall dorky. And nobody would want the cops chasing them on a Segway that might go at 12+ mph.

[charmed]

No kidding.

Why there haven't been huge sales to airport security is beyond me. If only for the line of sight afforded by the extra height.

[ziggystardust_]

price. it's all about price. The current price point is too prohibitive for commercial venues (and military/government,etc.) to purchase them in any fleet capacity. And I don't know that 8 inches is worth 10k (insert your own joke here)

The Zigman

[n/a]

I hear u Ziggy. But price has to be weighed up against benefit/functionality in the commercial sector. Some firms will be exclusively be focused on increased productivity, others may find less tangible (human) factors as having relevance. Eg. a happy employee is a more productive employee. I have not suggested that adding 8 inches to the hight of the rider will be the main factor. For some individuals it might be though if they have severe inferiority complex due to their stature. BTW have u studied Segway's presentation of how using Segways will save money for both consumer and commerce? I would be interested in your analysis.

A little aside, anyone know how much it costs to increase the size of a penis by a couple of inches? ;) That should be an indicator as to what people are willing to pay to increase their "manliness".

[charmed]

I just think that a typical airport must have hundreds of vehicles, all of which dwarf Segway's cost, many of them transporting a single person a lot of the time. It just seems like with all the acres of corriders a Segway would be a natural, and affordable even at $5,000, $8000, or $9000.

Think of all the millions recently spent, and in the coming days, on security. Even with all the sophisticated equipment, a dedicated terrorist can still wreak havoc. Mobility and visability are so important that the cost could be justified, even at the higher end of the spectrum of what we have been hearing.

[ziggystardust_]

I certainly agree that height can play a factor in a Segway buying decision. I believe a report out of the NH police trial stated as much. but obviously not enough to purchase any units. Then again, police departments nationwide are in a budget crunch, so purchasing these at a price point other than 'free' or 'really, really, really cheap' would not be feasible.

As far as other airport vehicle, you have to look at sunk costs/switching costs/maintenance costs. It may very well be that the fact that they spent so much on those other airport transportation vehicles precludes them from spending any more on other vehicles such as the HT. what does it cost to maintain a current airport cart vs. a Segway, etc.

When analyzing the benefits of the Segway there are tangible as well as intangible benefits to weigh out. I would hazard that intangible benefits would be even more of a factor (closer proximity to people, added height, 'wow' factor, fun, more motivation, etc.) than the tangible beneifts when weighed against the alternatives. Unfortunately this economy is not conducive to making a buying decision on what is a capital expenditure for beneifts that cannot be rolled into a revenue enhancement or cost reduction figure. Intangible benefits are notorious for being quantitatively elusive.

Lawrence, I've done some studying on the cost reduction (money saving) aspects on the consumer and commercial side. The calculations basically show the time you can save to get somewhere by using a Segway rather than walking and rather than taking a car for those short trips. No other alternatives compared.

So for commercial let's look at Postal. Let's assume that a postal worker can shave 2 hours off of their daily route (right now it's a wash because they have to figure out how to sort and ride at the same time). Segway's analysis just creates an equality statement i.e. if you save 2 hours a day and a postal worker earns 12 bucks an hour, then USPS is saving 24 dollars a day for each postal worker that rides a Segway on their route.

Unfortunately life and business isn't that linear. USPS doesn't just bank 24 dollars every day for each Segway rider. What they have to do is determine how those 2 hours can be used during the day in order to achieve some measure of cost savings. And remember that the USPS have a giant workers' union to deal with. So anything that has to do with worker attrition is going to be heavily contested. So I'm not sure how USPS would use any time savings.

So that's the real crux of determining feasibility in commercial and government venues that have a large union presence. How else, besides attrition, can any time savings be used.

For consumers getting where you are going faster than walking will allow you to perhaps engage in other activities that you didn't have time for before. You would have to determine how much time is saved, whether a cheaper alternative can be used, and whether the time savings would be worth the ticket price (somewhere between 3-8k since Tobe is now saying that their long term consumer target price is 3k).

As far as car replacement, I still have a little trouble with that one. The story is that families will now be able to get rid of that 2nd car in favor of a Segway. My issue is that most families don't maintain two cars so that they can use one for long trips and one for short trips so that they could replace the one for short trips with a Segway. Most people have 2 cars because either both adults work and need the car, or the husband (or wife) works and the other is home to care for the kids. In the former one would have to be close enough to their office to warrant getting rid of the car (as well as dealing with the elements when it rains, snows etc.). In the latter one would not be able to bring the kids with them if they went out. Not feasible with babies,toddlers, etc. So the real only scenario is if one adult works, the other just needs to do short-range errands during the day, and the kids (if any) are old enough to fend for themselves when the homemaker goes out.

So I think, from a cost savings standpoint it certainly is not cut and dry 'you save this amount of time so you save this much money'. That is an extremely simplistic and incorrect view of any perceived HT beneift.

The zigman

[Casey]

quote:So I'm not sure how USPS would use any time savings.


The keyword there is attrition. I was the shop steward for the NALC at a Florida USPS Office. You are correct that any attempt to unilaterally reduce the work force would meet strong opposition. There is little that can be done though to require hiring replacements for those quitting or retiring.

That means the savings might not all be immediate, but come over the period of time this attrition takes to reduce the workforce.

Frank

[n/a]

quote:That means the savings might not all be immediate, but come over the period of time this attrition takes to reduce the workforce.


Another not so immediate saving would be due to wear and tear of the workers. But as Zigman points out in an economic recession, one does not think so much about long term investments.

quote:How else, besides attrition, can any time savings be used.

By increasing the size of the area each worker covers and moving some people into other jobs maybe? and thereby reducing the number of new workers u need to hire?

quote:In the latter one would not be able to bring the kids with them if they went out. Not feasible with babies,toddlers, etc.

Babies can be carried in harnesses on the mother's back or bosom. Hopefully they will come up with 2 or more rider versions like we have seen in the patents.

quote:So the real only scenario is if one adult works, the other just needs to do short-range errands during the day, and the kids (if any) are old enough to fend for themselves when the homemaker goes out. Even if an individual or family has one car, substancial savings could be made by eliminating the short trips with the car according to the Segway site.

Wouldnt Segway be a lot more attractive in dense city centers, where cars average 6-8 mph making them a poor option for getting around?

[Casey]

quote:
How else, besides attrition, can any time savings be used.


quote:By increasing the size of the area each worker covers and moving some people into other jobs maybe? and thereby reducing the number of new workers u need to hire?

What you describe in your answer IS attrition.




Frank

[n/a]

quote:What you describe in your answer IS attrition.

Yes attrition due to people quitting or going into retirement as well as due to people being shuffled around.

[Casey]

quote:Wouldnt Segway be a lot more attractive in dense city centers, where cars average 6-8 mph making them a poor option for getting around?


Other than recreational uses, I agree that crowded areas such as city business districts would be an ideal place for Segway to show its advantages. Courrier services in congested areas would especially benefit. Some might say the bicycle or motorscooters already employed for this do just fine and are cheaper. To that I say, try to turn those vehicles in a one or two foot radius. It is impossible. Segway is far more manuverable in a crowd than anything else except a skateboard or razor scooters, which are laughable alternatives at best.

Frank

[Casey]

My last post reminds me of an old song by Roger Miller. "You can't Rollerskate in a Buffalo Herd.

Frank

[Antagony]

Segway LLC may be in a dilema. They need to make Segway as attractive as possible to potential buyers, but they cannot play on their secret weapon for fear that the Segways will be catagorized as high tech toys.