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n/a
09-30-2002, 10:53 AM
A number of articles have come out in the last few days that are worth looking at:

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20020928&Category=APN&ArtNo=209280843&Ref=AR

quote:Starting next year Californians could be zipping along sidewalks on electric personal assistive mobility devices under a bill signed Saturday by Gov. Gray Davis.

quote:Segway has built an assembly plant in Manchester, N.H., that is designed to produce 40,000 transporters a month by the end of 2003.

Apparently they are willing to tell us what they plan to produce by the end of 2003, but not what they are producing now. Is that because they are not producing very many?

quote:Torlakson's bill takes effect March 1 and will sunset on Jan. 1, 2008.

Will March 1 be the date for the consumer model launch I wonder?

http://www.unionleader.com/articles_show.html?article=14512

quote:Plans call for consumer models to be made available in a few locations late this year or early 2003. The price will be somewhere between $3,000 and $5,000, he said.

Hopefully the price will include the extra gear required in some states.




n/a
09-30-2002, 03:51 PM
quote:“They’ve become a little more commonplace,” agreed Shane McDonough, manager of Margaritas Mexican Restaurant. Most of the Segway riders come in at dinnertime, riding the machines right to their tables.

“I don’t agree with them riding them into the restaurant, but I know why they’re doing it; they want to sell it,” McDonough said.

Hope there will be more tolerance for this sort of thing in the near future. It would alleviate the storage/security problem.

We know about drive-in restaurants, I wonder who will be the first to open a Segin-restaurant?

muckle
09-30-2002, 04:56 PM
>> Manchester police, however, report no problems with Segways. No collisions. No pedestrian accidents. No tickets. <<

Oh, my. We may have to talk rollin, cheney & groovy off the ledge!

CephasH
09-30-2002, 04:58 PM
quote:
quote:
“I don’t agree with them riding them into the restaurant, but I know why they’re doing it; they want to sell it,” McDonough said.

Hope there will be more tolerance for this sort of thing in the near future. It would alleviate the storage/security problem.

We know about drive-in restaurants, I wonder who will be the first to open a Segin-restaurant?


But where do Segways get stored once they are inside the restaurant? I can see that if a party of 6 rolls in on Segways that there is going to be a crowding problem around their table. A riderless Segway has the footprint of an extra chair. The storage problem hasn't been alleviated, just moved to a new venue. McDonough has a legitimate gripe. This is going to be an ongoing issue at restaurants, theaters, reception areas in offices; anywhere that you are going to dismount and take a seat.

Regarding Segin-restaurant: Don't push your luck and try the drive-thru window at Wendy's in the US. They have a formal policy of not taking orders from pedestrians, skaters or bicycles. Something about liability and not wanting them to get squished by cars. Bet that it will extend to Segways.

CephasH
09-30-2002, 05:18 PM
quote:Originally posted by muckle

>> Manchester police, however, report no problems with Segways. No collisions. No pedestrian accidents. No tickets. <<

Oh, my. We may have to talk rollin, cheney & groovy off the ledge!


What could they ticket a Segway for?
And what will happen to the first Segway/DEKA employee who does generate serious negative Segway publicity? I hear Kamen has a pretty short fuse.

ziggystardust_
09-30-2002, 05:49 PM
quote:Originally posted by CephasH

quote:Originally posted by muckle

>> Manchester police, however, report no problems with Segways. No collisions. No pedestrian accidents. No tickets. <<

Oh, my. We may have to talk rollin, cheney & groovy off the ledge!


What could they ticket a Segway for?
And what will happen to the first Segway/DEKA employee who does generate serious negative Segway publicity? I hear Kamen has a pretty short fuse.


since segway riders are regulated as pedestrians I imagine the same infractions would apply, so a ticket could be issued for things like jaywalking (jaysegging?).

ziggystardust_
09-30-2002, 05:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by Lawrence
Apparently they are willing to tell us what they plan to produce by the end of 2003, but not what they are producing now. Is that because they are not producing very many?



evidently, also note that the statement you quoted shows what the factory will be capable of producing by the end of 2003 (once the facility has been fully ramped up and staffed), not what Segway plans on producing.

4Seg
09-30-2002, 07:33 PM
quote:Originally posted by Lawrence

A number of articles have come out in the last few days that are worth looking at:

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20020928&Category=APN&ArtNo=209280843&Ref=AR

quote:Starting next year Californians could be zipping along sidewalks on electric personal assistive mobility devices under a bill signed Saturday by Gov. Gray Davis.

quote:Segway has built an assembly plant in Manchester, N.H., that is designed to produce 40,000 transporters a month by the end of 2003.

Apparently they are willing to tell us what they plan to produce by the end of 2003, but not what they are producing now. Is that because they are not producing very many?

quote:Torlakson's bill takes effect March 1 and will sunset on Jan. 1, 2008.

Will March 1 be the date for the consumer model launch I wonder?

http://www.unionleader.com/articles_show.html?article=14512

quote:Plans call for consumer models to be made available in a few locations late this year or early 2003. The price will be somewhere between $3,000 and $5,000, he said.

Hopefully the price will include the extra gear required in some states.


Does anyone remember my TIQ/Segway p-series predictions?
March 1st lol

If we could only be resellers...

See the Segway clips! http://www.stlsegway.com/movies

4Seg
09-30-2002, 07:35 PM
quote:Originally posted by Lawrence

A number of articles have come out in the last few days that are worth looking at:

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?Date=20020928&Category=APN&ArtNo=209280843&Ref=AR

quote:Starting next year Californians could be zipping along sidewalks on electric personal assistive mobility devices under a bill signed Saturday by Gov. Gray Davis.

quote:Segway has built an assembly plant in Manchester, N.H., that is designed to produce 40,000 transporters a month by the end of 2003.

Apparently they are willing to tell us what they plan to produce by the end of 2003, but not what they are producing now. Is that because they are not producing very many?

quote:Torlakson's bill takes effect March 1 and will sunset on Jan. 1, 2008.

Will March 1 be the date for the consumer model launch I wonder?

http://www.unionleader.com/articles_show.html?article=14512

quote:Plans call for consumer models to be made available in a few locations late this year or early 2003. The price will be somewhere between $3,000 and $5,000, he said.

Hopefully the price will include the extra gear required in some states.


prediction was also made on this forum as well. Did anyone read about the case study to be conducted in CA? The p will need to be available and legal to do the study.



If we could only be resellers...

See the Segway clips! http://www.stlsegway.com/movies

n/a
10-01-2002, 07:57 AM
quote:evidently, also note that the statement you quoted shows what the factory will be capable of producing by the end of 2003 (once the facility has been fully ramped up and staffed), not what Segway plans on producing.

U are right Ziggy, the fact that "Segway has built an assembly plant in Manchester, N.H., that is designed to produce 40,000 transporters a month by the end of 2003" does not meant that they have plans to do so. But in the context I interpret it as they "hope" to do so or anticipate a potential need to be able to produce at that magnitude. For all we know, "designed" simply means that they have enough space to expand production if needed.

Antagony
10-01-2002, 12:04 PM
quote:Manchester police, however, report no problems with Segways. No collisions. No pedestrian accidents. No tickets.

muckle, I suspect that Kamen has a lot of friends and supporters in his neck of the woods. It could required the formation of a Segway version of Hell's Angels to get the police or the population riled up about Segways in Kamen's neighbourhood.

At this point the people allowed to ride Segways are hand picked. They have to be on their best behviour. Still some Segway employees have taken the liberty of riding them into resaurants without asking permission. That is just a little agressive advertizing though. What we might expect from the general population could be a different story.

Casey
10-01-2002, 12:36 PM
Quite frankly, as much as I see many uses for Segway, I personally object to taking them into public buildings. I see no harm in taking one to your work station and storing it safely out of the way until time to use it again. But I would have as much objection to people bringing them into restaurants and malls/shopping-facilities as I do to that use of any other form of transportation. Handicapped yes, everybody else leave them locked up outside. Revive the old hitching posts so they can be secured from theft, but leave them outside. Dismounting one indoors effectively makes two of you by doubling the space you require. I don't think anyone has a right to take the space of two people so they don't have to walk a few feet to get to their dining table.

As far as I'm concerned, the ones taking them into restaurants etc are being rude.

dupa
10-01-2002, 05:19 PM
I think they are taking them into buildings now for two reasons, promotion, but more importantly, they don't dare leave them outside. Who wants to explain to Kamen that they lost the first one?
And as they take the footprint of one person, not two, you aren't talking about much congestion(but parking inside is certainly an issue).

Antagony
10-01-2002, 07:02 PM
quote:I think they are taking them into buildings now for two reasons, promotion, but more importantly, they don't dare leave them outside. Who wants to explain to Kamen that they lost the first one?

Segways are supposedly useless without the keys. But then most thieves would not know this. At this point a Segway would be valuable even if it wasnt rideable?

dupa
10-01-2002, 07:10 PM
Good points Antagony. I think people would steal them just to take them apart and because they are such a novelty now, usable or not.
And it would certainly be valuable to someone trying to copy the technology, or study it.

Casey
10-01-2002, 07:32 PM
quote:And as they take the footprint of one person, not two, you aren't talking about much congestion(but parking inside is certainly an issue).

I didn't say a Segway takes up the space of two people. It is slightly more than one person in floor space used. But if you dismount as you would have to to eat, shop etc you then also take the space of one person. A Segway combined with the dismounted rider would definitely take the space of two people, or slightly more.

They could be secured outdoors in the same way a bicycle or motorcycle can. All those items can be easily picked up by an automobile wrecker, and they frequently are. Nonetheless I do not believe they belong in public buildings. It is up to the owner to secure them from theft as he would have to if he were riding any other device.

I think they would also be a major nuisance if you were trying to enjoy your meal and they were wheeling around you. I really think they have overstepped their boundry in taking them into restaurants etc.

dupa
10-01-2002, 07:47 PM
I said the parking inside was an issue. I agree they are pushing the boundaries, but with Kamen at the helm, what else would you expect? The Union Leader article painted a very positive picture in general(not that they would be biased....), but the inside issue is a real one, and could cause a lot of bad PR. I'm sure parking them outside will become normal, and in the pictures in yesterdays Union Leader, I noticed the Segways pictured had those new locks wrapped around the base of the post, ready for use. They look like bicycle locks, plastic coated chains or cables.

muckle
10-02-2002, 10:59 AM
Antagony - well, according to the bashers, the Segway is inherently dangerous to pedestrians, autos, baby seals, the Pope, etc.

I was merely pointing out that there hasn't been wholesale bloodshed yet...

Antagony
10-02-2002, 12:36 PM
quote:Originally posted by muckle

Antagony - well, according to the bashers, the Segway is inherently dangerous to pedestrians, autos, baby seals, the Pope, etc.

I was merely pointing out that there hasn't been wholesale bloodshed yet...

Nor is there likely to be wholesale bloodshed. If there comes a time when Segwaylike vehicles dominate the sidewalks, I foresee sidewalk rage as a real possibility. I foresee pedestrians that will not want to make way for Seggies riders and I foresee Seggies getting very irritated by slow moving pedestrians blocking their way and upsetting their busy schedules.

I am not in the Segway basher camp who want to ban Segways before they are even tried, but nor am I not with the Segway supporters either, that paint a rosy colored picture of an harmonious intigration of Segways and pedestrians.

I can understand that Segway wants as much leeway as possible to introduce the Segways and eliminate all the "roadblocks" against its introduction. I can also understand pedestrian concerns that they want more safety tests and regulations to ensure that Segways wont be a menice on sidewalks.

An observation I made with regard to walking on bike paths... I noticed that when I hear a bike coming from in front of me or see a bike coming in front of me, it is not see easy to take a relaxed stroll. I automatically make way for the biker to enable him/her to pass. This could be less of a problem with Segways though, since I know they can balance better at slow speeds. Still, people travelling at different speeds on the same paths automatically creates some tension. Will this be a problem in the future I wonder? Will the benefits of using Segways outweight such disadvantages?

dupa
10-02-2002, 12:59 PM
Antagony has answered his own question. The benefits of using Segway outweigh disadvantages, in my opinion. When you factor in all the pluses, reduced noise, pollution, congestion, heat, dependence on foreign oil etc., it is a no-brainer, to me anyway.
There will be concerns from pedestrians and others, as there should be, but these things will be worked out.

CephasH
10-02-2002, 04:49 PM
quote:Originally posted by dupa

Antagony has answered his own question. The benefits of using Segway outweigh disadvantages, in my opinion. When you factor in all the pluses, reduced noise, pollution, congestion, heat, dependence on foreign oil etc., it is a no-brainer, to me anyway.
There will be concerns from pedestrians and others, as there should be, but these things will be worked out.


Your pluses exist only if you are using your Segway to replace exisiting travel done by auto. Even then, unless your electricity is coming from solar, wind or hydro power, the pollution, heat and (maybe) dependence on foreign oil have just been moved out of sight, not eliminated. If you are using your Segway as magic sneakers to increase your walking range or speed (or just because you are lazy) then all your pluses go straight out window. Then its just a productivity tool with no real 'green' benefits. (Not to imply that productivity in itself is not a worthy goal.)Be careful about how you intend to use your Segway before giving it too many envronmental pluses.

n/a
10-02-2002, 06:53 PM
quote:Your pluses exist only if you are using your Segway to replace exisiting travel done by auto. Even then, unless your electricity is coming from solar, wind or hydro power, the pollution, heat and (maybe) dependence on foreign oil have just been moved out of sight, not eliminated.

Cephash, do u have some good arguments as to why Segway might not reduce the number of short automobile trips in many cities, considering that people could reach their destinations faster and cheaper? Do u have any estimates as to how much Segways might contribute to pollution by using electricity. I seem to recall having read that a Segway is about 700 times more energy efficient than the average car.

Seeker
10-03-2002, 04:27 PM
quote:

Nor is there likely to be wholesale bloodshed. If there comes a time when Segwaylike vehicles dominate the sidewalks, I foresee sidewalk rage as a real possibility. I foresee pedestrians that will not want to make way for Seggies riders and I foresee Seggies getting very irritated by slow moving pedestrians blocking their way and upsetting their busy schedules.




Hi Antagony,

I agree with you. I see a real possibility of sidewalk conflicts, although I anticipate that most Segway riders will be courteous, and most pedestrians generally accepting of them.

One thing the Segway does have in its favour, is that it rides well on grass, so if Segway riders need to, much of the time they'll have the opportunity to ride on the grass beside the sidewalk, as they pass pedestrians.


Seeker

n/a
10-05-2002, 07:08 AM
Here are a couple of other articles with some new content:

http://tanzania.northjersey.com/publications/montclairtimes/page.php?page=3699

Apparently Zimmerman was allowed to buy a Segway for his personal use.
quote:“I live four blocks from work,” Kennedy said, “and I take a 3,000-pound vehicle back and forth, back and forth.”

He was required to take a one day course. I wonder if that was in addition to a riding course?

quote:Before Segway would sell the transporter to Zimmerman, he had to sit through a daylong tutorial on what makes the vehicle tick. Zimmerman attended the session Tuesday last week.


Zimmerman advises that one buys liability insurance! What might that cost I wonder?

Apparently the deluxe version will have "mail bags" which will function as bumpers for additional safety. I remember suggesting this idea some time ago. [8D] The disadvantage will be that the "bare bones model" wont have "bumpers" and these bags will increase the space required for the Segway.

Here is an interesting viewpoint:

quote:“It’s a private moving sidewalk that promises a whole new way of moving around the world,” Smith added. “It’s the most useful toy I’ve ever seen.”

Percieved in this way, there might be more people interested in buying it. It will be interesting to see how they market the consumer models, will they push the fun aspect or the utility aspect?

quote:Top speed, Zimmerman said, is 14 miles per hour.


The speed at which this one will go is 14 mph. This is getting confusing! Apparently the Segways top speed will be limited to various speeds depending on where they are sold.

quote:The key to relaxing on the vehicle, Zimmerman said, is knowing that it’s impossible to fall off.

I dont think it is very good to make such exaggerations. When people do fall off it is going to get noticed. See my next posting.

U guys might want to vote on this question on that site:

quote:Would a Segway transporter be a valuable tool for the Oconomowoc Police Department?

n/a
10-05-2002, 07:22 AM
Here is the other article:

http://tanzania.northjersey.com/publications/montclairtimes/page.php?page=3699

quote:"You would have to work hard to sell me on this idea," he said, noting that while attending a NASCAR race, he saw an individual using the Segway fall from it.

When some people claim that it is impossible to fall off Segway and
somebody sees a Segway rider "fall off" the vehicle it is going to make an impression.

I wonder how many other people at the race saw somebody falling off. It could have caused Segway considerable dammage if the TV cameras recorded that.


Both praise and criticizm continues for Segway...

quote:The mayor has discussed the idea with Police Chief and Public Safety Director Hugh Martin, who expressed some concerns over the Segway.

Martin said that while the Segway did interest him and he has done additional research on it, he also had concerns.

" ... I think the big question is, what are we going to do with it when we get it?" Martin said to the council.

I do wonder about what sort of research Martin has done.

n/a
10-10-2002, 11:45 AM
Apparently they are still working on marketing/distribution strategy:

quote:The maximum rate of production would approximate, in terms of units, the output of two automobile assembly plants, meaning lots of potential customers. A tricky detail in Segway's business plan -- retail strategy -- hasn't been decided yet.

One possibility is to award franchises to automobile or motorcycle dealers, who have experience dealing with retail customers and operate service departments.

A second retail strategy is to sell through an established non-automotive retailer like Best Buy, Wal-Mart or Circuit City. Finally, Segway might open its own stores, which would be more costly, but would give the company closer control over training buyers and teaching them how to use the HT safely among pedestrians.

http://bloomberg.com/feature/feature1034257674.html