Layoffs at DEKA

[dupa]

About a month ago, DEKA(also known as The Kamen Institute of Life Enhancement) laid off 10% of its' workforce. I would conclude that the dismal performance of Segway might be factor in this unfortunate happening. One might also conclude that a change in fortune at Segway would help this situation. From the limited reading I've done here, it's easy to see that there couldn't be a more enthusiastic group of people out there promoting Segway. Obviously, it's not enough. As many have pointed out, Segway marketing(or lack there of) is a disaster. What is the quickest way to turn things around?

[pam]

Gads, such doom and gloom. I think we assume too much when we assume that employment at DEKA has anything to do with Dean's Segway venture. They're two separate organizations. And I also think it's presumptous to assume that the Segeay marketing is a cause for any of this, or that it's even a disaster. This can be your opinion, but it certainly is not mine. Personally I think Segway is still finding it's niche, and however long that takes, I think that's fine. I wouldn't presume to tell them how to "turn it around" because they now have experts available to do that - and they may not even be concerned with "turning it around" because they may well be happy with where it is at this point in the marketplace.
Pam

[BruceWright]

Since DEKA is funded out of Dean's pocket, and his pocket has taken quite a hit, I think we can say that yes, this is as a result of Segway, somewhat.

-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

[terryp]

Considering that they set up their factory to turn out 40,000 HTs per month, it's hard to imagine that they're happy/not concerned with sales over a year later. What have the 'experts' done so far?

Practicing safe Segs in Seattle

[mattk]

2 of my friend's parents got the boot. One was a software engineer and another a math-type engineer.

They both got new jobs almost instantly... yet it kinda sucks when you think you have great job security and as you are leaving one day you find out you shouldnt come back the next.

[SegwayUtah]

I'm not a big fan of analyzing private companies. People keep their companies private because, well, they want them to be private :)

That said, DEKA is a research and development company. I imagine that their workload fluctuates from time to time. "Code Name Ginger," indicated that Dean Kamen considers employees like family. Appropriately, I don't know that DEKA has ever let people go for cost-cutting reasons, although I also don't know if a company can do that forever.

Anyway, it sounds like a great company to work for in many ways: super-sharp people with vision, etc.

Chris

[ElectraGlide]

It's one thing to be optimistic......it's another to be realistic. Or like myself, who is a pessimist about this story...( and a pessimist is an optimist with experience! ). Low numbers are not good. No manufacturer in the world would be happy with 6-7k units per year when a factory is built expecting 40k or more a month. The suppliers of batteries, wheels, fenders, etc sign contracts to supply a certain number of items at a certain price......well, if the volume is lower, then I imagine contracts need to be re-written and costs rise . Toss into this equation zero advertising, a recall PR blunder, and you all can figure out "the rest of the story".
I'll be buying another "p" model within the next couple weeks...I hope it helps someone keep their job a bit longer.
It's so simple.....they need to sell more machines....it's time for them to remove their own obstacles.

Steve

[mrleisure]

quote:Originally posted by dupa

As many have pointed out, Segway marketing(or lack there of) is a disaster. What is the quickest way to turn things around?


I'm still trying to figure out why anyone really cares. Truly, I'm stumped. Can anyone explain to me this un-natural fascination with Segway 's business affairs?

Maybe Dean should flake off and start a religious cult. "Seganetics" or maybe "DEKAtology" or something. I have a spooky feeling there would be people lining up to carry out his bidding with nary a skeptical thought. "Yea- I rode a Segway and it cleared up my skin rash and anxiety condition, Thank you L. Dean Kamen"







"In the future, we will all drive standing up"
David Byrne, in 1984

[BruceWright]

Why do people care, Mrlesure?

I think a lot of the appeal for early Segway adopters was that they were the vanguard of a changed world.

It's very hard to continue to change the world if the company goes out of business.

Sure, we'll still have our Segways. But they'll be merely curiosities.

Either way, I'm satisfied. I love my Segway, and it's kind of cool that it's so rare.

But I wouldn't want them to fail. I want them to succeed.



-Bruce Wright

Segway: Vehicle of Dream

[Entil-Zha]

Thanks mrleisure:

Your reply did make me laugh. I knew there had to be something entertaining in this thread.

[ElectraGlide]

quote:Originally posted by mrleisure

[quote]Originally posted by dupa



I'm still trying to figure out why anyone really cares. Truly, I'm stumped. Can anyone explain to me this un-natural fascination with Segway 's business affairs?



I for one watch lots of businesses. Many that I own through stocks, and others with just an outsiders curiosity. When I see a company like LLC making what I think are big mistakes there is a place like this to jot down my opinion or suggestions.....Thats what chat rooms are all about.....giving our opinions on a wide variety of subjects.
Does it matter in the big scheme of things...probably not, but thats not the point...some of us are just not content to silently sit on the sidelines .


Steve

[Itsi Atkins]

I am not a marketing expert, but to me it seens so easy to turn it around. I would make deals with the major car manufactures of SUV's, recreation vechiles, Hummer etc. The segway would be an acessory which fits into the trunk or behind the seats. Desinged to be part of the car. A spare tire for the people and a way to enjoy the roads jump off explore and return. I would do the same with the yacht and boats. and a big deal with cruise lines and golf industry. Any one of these ideas could sell a lot of Segways. Let the big companies sell it in addition to the big transportation investment which the customer is buying. forget the one on one, that market will take forever and is a best icing on the cake of good business relationships, advertising and marketing,but I make movies not sell Segways.

[Stewbonz]

Make the Segway available to international buyers. It's a big world out there and they want a Segway. Heck, an I Series in Europe only costs 3,750 Euros.

JEFF JARVIS
http://www.thailandsegwaytours.com/

[JohnM]

quote:Originally posted by Itsi Atkins

I am not a marketing expert, but to me it seens so easy to turn it around. I would make deals with the major car manufactures of SUV's, recreation vechiles, Hummer etc. The segway would be an acessory which fits into the trunk or behind the seats. Desinged to be part of the car. A spare tire for the people and a way to enjoy the roads jump off explore and return. Itsi, you should be in marketing, because Hummer is doing just that. Only not with Segways.quote:Sara Clampitt, Montague’s director of marketing and business development, said the company struck a deal with General Motors to sell the automaker folding mountain bikes that tuck neatly into the back of the new H2s.http://www.montagueco.com/april03bicycleretailermagazine.html
http://www.hummerbikes.com/

[jbsoftware]

If you want a few reasons why the Segway is not selling well
then read some of the responses to my query on freeway use.
We are a car fixated society. Everything, our culture, our
morals, our very way of life revolves around car ownership.
Our infrastructure is set up for cars and not Segways. Until
we changed that attitude then Segway is doomed to go the way
of another spectacular invention called "Holography", a solution
without a problem.

John

[Itsi Atkins]

Segway should not get so serious, it is not changing the way we move. It is an added plus in the world of exploring the urban and countryside. It is new, unique, and one of a kind, so market it as such, but do it in bulk.

[jbsoftware]

quote:Originally posted by Itsi Atkins

Segway should not get so serious, it is not changing the way we move. It is an added plus in the world of exploring the urban and countryside. It is new, unique, and one of a kind, so market it as such, but do it in bulk.


Being an inventor/business person myself I can tell you from
experience that to sell 40k units per month requires a potential
customer base of 40k X 1000 customers and you are not
going to get that kind of bulk from joy riders!

John

[Itsi Atkins]

Your right but think of how many will be sold with automobiles as a high end acessories, QM2 will arrive in NYC this week ( you'll see the pics), think how many it could use and multiply that by number of cruise ships worldwide. Add the golfers of the world, NYC has more mileage underground than above. the unions have expressed interest in using it for inspections and repairs. Think out of the box and creative! you can find non-joy ride use waiting to spend our tax dollars with LLC. The industrial use and military use should not be a secret, if Segway was the main tool for homeland security and robotic bomb searches and chemical dirty bomb testing, it would win the hearts of all. Is there one Segway in Bagdad, maybe we need to produce our own "Wag the Dog", a SegRat 1' off the ground at night, guns slowly rotating 360 degrees with lights, searching the pathways of enemy infested ratholes. Finding Mr. "B", remote cameras send images to CIA,as the President watchs the Segway capture Mr. "B" laden, he says, "you know, I fell off one of those in 03" Segway Saves the World.
(end credits)

[jbsoftware]

quote:Originally posted by Itsi Atkins

Your right but think of how many will be sold with automobiles as a high end acessories, QM2 will arrive in NYC this week ( you'll see the pics), think how many it could use and multiply that by number of cruise ships worldwide. Add the golfers of the world, NYC has more mileage underground than above. the unions have expressed interest in using it for inspections and repairs. Think out of the box and creative! you can find non-joy ride use waiting to spend our tax dollars with LLC. The industrial use and military use should not be a secret, if Segway was the main tool for homeland security and robotic bomb searches and chemical dirty bomb testing, it would win the hearts of all. Is there one Segway in Bagdad, maybe we need to produce our own "Wag the Dog", a SegRat 1' off the ground at night, guns slowly rotating 360 degrees with lights, searching the pathways of enemy infested ratholes. Finding Mr. "B", remote cameras send images to CIA,as the President watchs the Segway capture Mr. "B" laden, he says, "you know, I fell off one of those in 03" Segway Saves the World.
(end credits)


Cute ideas but 40k X 1000 = 40,000,000 and your proposed
markets still do not make it.

[Sid Viscous]

How sure are you of that.

My understanding is that Segway had a layoff, not DEKA, and in fact some Segway employees were moved to DEKA.

Quite the opposite of what you state.

In other words, what's your source.

[SegwayUtah]

quote:Originally posted by Sid Viscous

How sure are you of that.

My understanding is that Segway had a layoff, not DEKA, and in fact some Segway employees were moved to DEKA.

Quite the opposite of what you state.

In other words, what's your source.


I was actually surprised to hear that there were layoffs at DEKA too. Who knows what is or is not true. If it isn't accurate, it sure shows how eagar people are for Segway news, good or bad.

Chris

[Itsi Atkins]

Chris are you putting out bad info?

[Itsi Atkins]

sorry Chris I thought for a moment you were the author of the thread!

[dupa]

I started this thread. I got the story from an engineer who was laid off. Her husband is a customer of mine and I talked to both of them.
I haven't seen any denials from DEKA.
I would agree with anyone who says that it is mighty presumptuous for me or others to begin to tell these people(at Segway) how to turn things around, but really, at this point I think they have to be kicked and pushed into doing something to sell more Segways. Their efforts to date are nothing more than a bad joke. Very sad.

[Sid Viscous]

Don't get me wrong. I'm the first to say they need to turn things around. But look into it. Segway had layoffs, I didn't hear of DEKA having layoffs, and that would be completely un-precedented I believe.

And I don't believe that Dean is really Hurting in the pocket, maybe not doing as well as he once did, buthe's not going to be on food stamps anytime soon. There are plenty of things at DEKA bringing in the bacon.

[dupa]

Sid, look into it? I thought I did. I live in NH and work ten minutes from DEKA. I talked to real people I already knew, one of whom worked at DEKA and is now looking for work. What more do you want? You need to take a closer look.
The same week I got this info, I ran into a Segway production worker who told me they had an upbeat meeting that week because production was up to 300 units a week.
Sounds like a story, I know, but it's true.

[mrleisure]

Dude, posting facts to SegwayChat regarding production numbers? If you notice a black Hummer following you around be sure to run like hell. I'll shelter you in Idaho if need be.

Seriously though- A million bucks in weekly sales is a decent start for a small manufacturer. Seems like it would be enough to keep the doors open and the investors off their backs anyway.

Good for them!

quote:Originally posted by dupa
The same week I got this info, I ran into a Segway production worker who told me they had an upbeat meeting that week because production was up to 300 units a week.
Sounds like a story, I know, but it's true.


"In the future, we will all drive standing up"
David Byrne, in 1984

[GadgetmanKen]

I can feel their pain. Layoffs are at most very tramatizing to ourselves and families. I had been laid off after 8 years on the job back in January of 2002. It to say the least, led to one of the worst years of my life following that. Financially and emotionally.

Were they engineers for the design of the Segway? Deka, I have heard has at least one hundred engineers on their staff. It may be that they were engineers for the I-bot which led to the Segway. Wasn't the I-bot sold to Johnson & Johnson? Wouldn't that possibly explain why they were laid off? I have also heard that there are some other companies working on software modifications for the Segway, too. I imagine that their expertise on certain projects were no longer needed. I don't think it has much to do with the sales of the Segway. Projects come and they go.

quote: Until we changed that attitude then Segway is doomed to go the way of another spectacular invention called "Holography", a solution without a problem.


There are several video games out there that have laser disc holograms used during play which are great fun. One solution? I have several holograms one of which is a Star Trek image of a Ferengi/Klingon/Borg visible on all sides of each facial image all into one image. You just move from side to side to see each image pop up. Its my favorite. The design studio who made it also had in its possession a hologram which they wanted $500.00 for, which fifteen years ago I could have bought for $50. There were only two or three made of this one particular type. No one can even tell how they were made or exactly how they work, but this one in particular looked so real. It was a black box about five inches square and looked like a cd laying on top of it. The cd looking thing was spinning. When the light hit it an image lept above it about four inched high. It was an attractive dark haired woman on her knees and she rotated around in circles. She wore a black vest and when she turned her back to you she opened her vest exposing herself, but know matter how hard you tried you could not see her breasts. When she rotated around towards you she closed her vest. It was absolutely stunning. A hologram collector ended up buying this hologram for thousands of dollars, and I could have bought it for 50 fifteen years ago when it first came out. There is a comany here in Brown County, Indiana that will make holograms of you, your family or whatever for around $600. up. I love to brouse there and look at all of the holograms images they have made and sell. An example of a good use. Eh?

"Wouldn't it be cool, if?...is like Folgers in my cup"

[Roy_V_Thompson]

What about a function? Golf is a natural, I play with mine. Our local golf courses are less than pleased as cart rentals are a major source of revenue. What wrong with a Segway open golf tournment?